GT-R laps Nurburgring in 7:29; sets production car record

[free_energy0]

Originally Posted by void.crusader

I hope you know that weight doesn't affect car top speed? Only power and aero drag.

For me, living in US, I couldn't care less what top speed the car have.

Weight does effect top speed by increasing rolling resistance as the tire flexes.

Many GT-R haters are eating crow now (Haskell, PMC,etc.). Apologies and humility are in order

[CobaltSScrazy]

the new standard has been set. Hopefully GTR Vspec runs in the 7 minutes and teens or breaks below 7:10!!!

I hope ZR1 pans out to be the world beater its hyped up to be. Recent GM 'great world class auto's' have been living up to expectations and hopefully GM follows suit with ZR1. If its just the best car GM ever built and not 'better' than the GTR versions and on par with Porsches latest and greatest, then I would love nothing more than to see it get annihilated and embarrassed so Corvette standards get raised yet again and GM comes back with a car that outdoes the Vspec GTR by a long shot.

The consumer wins this one...

Better yet, lets see the XTS and get an XTC off it to compete with a bentley continental GT and the 6 series (and old CL / new CLS). I hope to the Heavens that happens. a "Big Brother" to the CTC-V!

CobaltSS

[Jimi]

Originally Posted by mbukukanyau

I am no expert, but, does a 1001 HP W16 rocket mill not improve on the Veyron's power to weight ratios, theys making its weight vs. power great. Remember, the Veyron is a small two seater rear engined supercar with a massive engine, AWD, and extremely good drag coeficient... Its built for speed... So weight was an issue.
As in, I am not disputing your case. I just need to get more info.
Did they build that monster out of steel only? Or is it using carbon fibre wood, etc like the Z06 or Enzo?

The 1001 HP certainly helps the power-to-weight ratio of the Veyron, but its only the power along with its drag coefficient that will have a significant impact on its top speed. Physics don't lie.

[Slideways]

Originally Posted by free_energy0

Weight does effect top speed by increasing rolling resistance as the tire flexes.

If the tire flexes too much it's underinflated or not suited for the vehicle. Rolling resistance is a teeny-tiny factory. Put Michael Moore behind the wheel of the Veyron with Oprah sitting shotgun and it will still hit 253mph, just the same as if Danica was at the wheel.

[void.crusader]

Originally Posted by mbukukanyau

I am no expert, but, does a 1001 HP W16 rocket mill not improve on the Veyron's power to weight ratios, theys making its weight vs. power great. Remember, the Veyron is a small two seater rear engined supercar with a massive engine, AWD, and extremely good drag coeficient... Its built for speed... So weight was an issue.
As in, I am not disputing your case. I just need to get more info.
Did they build that monster out of steel only? Or is it using carbon fibre wood, etc like the Z06 or Enzo?

1001ps mill certainly helps power/weight ratio, acceleration and top speed.
The thing is, VW boss had a wet dream of 400kmh car, and for this particular goal 4200 lbs car is just as good as 3500lbs. They could made it lighter, going RWD, manual, with smaller engine (Hennessey Viper 1000 comes to mind), but they choose not to.

Veyron doesn't have extremely good drag coefficient. Even at special speed-mode it's still quite a brick - 0.36.
GT-R have 0.27.

CdA for Veyron is 8.02, worser than Z06 or GT-R.
My guess is designers and marketing dep, not engineers, were given upper hand on this behemoth.

Originally Posted by free_energy0

Weight does effect top speed by increasing rolling resistance as the tire flexes.

As I said it's possible, but not necessarily - depends on the tire compound/structure and pressure.

[JBsZ06]

Nissan states this was run on standard tires..

Gotta give credit where credit is due..

Nissan's defnitely done a great job.

JB

[redTT]

Originally Posted by void.crusader

1001ps mill certainly helps power/weight ratio, acceleration and top speed.
The thing is, VW boss had a wet dream of 400kmh car, and for this particular goal 4200 lbs car is just as good as 3500lbs. They could made it lighter, going RWD, manual, with smaller engine (Hennessey Viper 1000 comes to mind), but they choose not to.

Veyron doesn't have extremely good drag coefficient. Even at special speed-mode it's still quite a brick - 0.36.
GT-R have 0.27.

CdA for Veyron is 8.02, worser than Z06 or GT-R.
My guess is designers and marketing dep, not engineers, were given upper hand on this behemoth.

I guess Bugatti didnt look at Cd or have as good an engineer as Nissan in developing their top speed monster. We all know that Cd isnt important in a top speed machine. All that millions spent developing a brick of a car, they should have just let Nissan engineer the ting. The same goes for Ferrari and Porsche, even with proven cars and racing expertise couldnt match Nissans unproven godzilla.

[redTT]

Originally Posted by mbukukanyau

I am no expert, but, does a 1001 HP W16 rocket mill not improve on the Veyron's power to weight ratios, theys making its weight vs. power great. Remember, the Veyron is a small two seater rear engined supercar with a massive engine, AWD, and extremely good drag coeficient... Its built for speed... So weight was an issue.
As in, I am not disputing your case. I just need to get more info.
Did they build that monster out of steel only? Or is it using carbon fibre wood, etc like the Z06 or Enzo?

Again Bugatti engineers is still restricted by physics, they should have hired Nissan engineers.

[void.crusader]

Originally Posted by redTT

I guess Bugatti didnt look at Cd or have as good an engineer as Nissan in developing their top speed monster. We all know that Cd isnt important in a top speed machine. All that millions spent developing a brick of a car, they should have just let Nissan engineer the ting. The same goes for Ferrari and Porsche, even with proven cars and racing expertise couldnt match Nissans unproven godzilla.

Sarcasm can't change facts, sorry mate.

There is simple explanation - Veyron body was shaped by designers, not by wind tunnel. Engineers just make the most out of it.

Oh and about that racing expertise ... 44 years ago:
The earliest predecessor of the GT-R, the S54 2000 GT-B, came second in its first race in 1964 to the purpose-built Porsche 904 GTS.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_Skyline_GT-R

So, is there really a reason to be surprised that modern GT-R does so well?

R34 GT-R held production record for the Nurburgring until Porsche 996 beat it.

[The Cruck]

It looks like the HHR S/S`s record (8:43) was shattered by over a minute, but the price was three times as much.
I`m still in good company.

[Tone]

Regarding top speed ... aero drag increases at a rate approximate square to its velocity. In other words, double your speed and you will require four times the power to overcome aero drag alone.

Since other forces (friction) increase roughly proportional to speed (or less) and weight is roughly a constant, the largest force to overcome -- by a signficant amount -- for top speed is wind resistance.

At very high speeds, the power demand for even more speed are huge. Note that the ZR1 is quoting a top speed of over 200 mph (I think 205 has been demonstrated with perhaps more to come). But, the Z06 hits 198 with 505 hp ... it taks over 100 hp more just to gain perhaps another 10 or so mph top speed.

[JerryL]

Every comment I've seen about lap time at the Ring' is only about the car. Maybe the lap time would be different with Oprah or Micheal Myer driving either car rather than the factory testers. Or some one could hire Klaus Ludwig for the day for bragging rights.
The coefficient of driver friction matters too.

[Almag]

^^ Thank you Captain Obvious...

[void.crusader]

Originally Posted by Tone

Regarding top speed ... aero drag increases at a rate approximate square to its velocity. In other words, double your speed and you will require four times the power to overcome aero drag alone.

Eight times the power. It's V^3.

Aero drag force is F = 0.5 * CdA * r * V^2
where r - density

But power required to overcome drag is
P = A/t = F*L/t = F*v = 0.5 * CdA * r * V^3
where A is amount of work and L is traveled length

Veyron at 407kmh at sea level:
P = 0.5 * 0.36 * 2.07m2 * 1.229kg/m3 * (113.06m/s)^3 = 661.79kW = 887hp

Looks pretty tight, considering that car should have at least 15% transmission loss (1000hp * 0.85 = 850hp). But then again, I heard that Veyron production engines are making between 1050 and 1100hp.

[supraracer]

Here is some more fuel for the fire:
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/05/02/c...he-ring-for-l/