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#16 (permalink) |
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3.8 Liter V6
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: UOIT, Oshawa
Drives: '93 Grand Am, shopping for a V8, RWD 6 speed car
Posts: 418
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
eurohazard:
I agree that bringing up different cars can change up the numbers a bit, but the head to head comparison of the 911 and GT-R does bring the story a bit closer together. An AWD car with a viscous coupling system and one full length shaft vs an AWD system with torque vectoring and two full shafts end up with the same hp difference they started with. It just doesn't make sense that the GT-R is 'putting out over 500' when there isn't any noise of the 911 being underrated (by 30+hp anyways), or the Z06 for that matter. The 20% figure tended to come from automatic cars, where the torque converter sucked back some power. DSG type transmissions as well, tend to be just as efficient (though not as strong) as single layshaft manuals. Either way, I'm positive the number isn't 20% (I'll try and find the link to where the Nissan engineer said it was under 15%, something about the gear cut, and lubricant, which could also relate to the lower capacity of the transmission). ptviperz: A full time AWD system (like a WRX or the like; a viscous centre diff, or a simple clutch centre) will have a ton of drag on the driveline that takes away power. However, Nissan's engineers have done a very good job of essentially making the vehicle drive each possible wheel as best as possible that they essentially make the car a RWD car when the tires grip and it is in a straight line. But it doesn't explain why the 911 is still faster, when it has a less 'techy' all wheel drive system and similar power. Either way, it's becoming a golden age of performance. Competition breeds it. Customers demand it. And an enthusiast would be nuts to deny any of the cars above. I just don't when certain things are taken as fact . |
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#17 (permalink) |
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6.2 Liter Vortec V8
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,510
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
I'm not sure the GT-R is going to be the bang-for-the-buck it's all cracked up to be... As much as I love the GT-R (and the Z06 by the way)... I was talking to a friend that was going to buy a GT-R.. He said the dealer in Chicago wants MSRP + 40 grand. He said they wouldn't let it go for less than $110,000.... He basically told the dealer to screw off, and is going to buy a 911 Turbo instead.
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#18 (permalink) | |
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6.0 Liter LS2 V8
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Midwest
Drives: 07' Monte Carlo SS
Posts: 4,128
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
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Pontiac tried the same thing with the GTO. Mazda used to get by with doing it to the Miata, Chrysler is doing it with the Challenger, Chevy will do it with the Camaro, yadda yadda. You have to be buying these cars for the right reason and you won’t be affected. That reason would be to impress yourself instead of your neighbors.
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07' SS Monte |
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#19 (permalink) |
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3.6 Liter V6
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,061
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
No one wants to be ripped off and should not be ripped off in the tune of $40k.
A_V_S has a right to complain and should complain, it doesnt matter the type of car. |
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#20 (permalink) | |
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6.0 Liter Vortec V8
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Travis AFB, CA
Posts: 1,771
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
There's a reason dealerships are called stealerships. It's not right, but this is America...capitalism at its finest (or worst). Let the gimps with too much money to blow get the first and second batch of X-car (in this case GT-R)....prices will back to MSRP.
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#21 (permalink) |
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3.8 Liter V6
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: UOIT, Oshawa
Drives: '93 Grand Am, shopping for a V8, RWD 6 speed car
Posts: 418
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
I don't like getting ripped off either, but a company doesn't have to sell at MSRP (keyword is 'suggested'). Rewards come for those who wait. People complained about GTO's being marked up at introduction, but then you could get an '06 for under 25k during 2007 (I'm sure there are still a few auto cars sitting around dealerships now too). But if you want to be the first on the block with one, be prepared to pay up for the 'privilege' of doing so.
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#22 (permalink) |
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6.0 Liter LS2 V8
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Midwest
Drives: 07' Monte Carlo SS
Posts: 4,128
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
So wait a couple of months to buy it so you can enjoy it instead of buying it to be the first on your block to impress your neighbors, problem solved. Not an issue, the only people that ever complain are the people with no intention of buying one.
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07' SS Monte |
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#23 (permalink) |
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6.2 Liter Vortec V8
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,510
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
I'm not complaining per se, I'm just saying this car might not be the bargain Nissan is saying it is because of the stealerships. At a minimum I'm hoping the dealers don't screw it up for those of us that do want one by making Nissan think the car is a flop because of cars sitting on dealer lots for extended times.
Ilm sure some will pay through the nose to say they have one, but I doubt these will fly off lots for $110,000. For that kinda money i'd want better dealer service than what you get at a typical Nissan dealer. Hell you can get a used lambo for that price, and that has more cachet than nissan ever will. reminds me of the Wii Fit. My wife wanted one, but everyone was sold out. There were tons on ebay, but they wanted $400 for just the game, when it retails for $90. I noticed that none of those e-bay auctions had any bids... I got the wii fit for $89 from a local shop after calling everyday and rushing in when they got their meager shipment. |
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#24 (permalink) |
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5.3 Liter LS4 V8
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Drives: 2001 Chevy Silverado
Posts: 3,130
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
I just saw a white GT-R on the road here in Vegas. The styling is definitely aggressive.
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#25 (permalink) | |
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6.0 Liter Vortec V8
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Travis AFB, CA
Posts: 1,771
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
Oh Neo, you should have taken the blue pill. So Nissan is well known for this kind of trickery huh? When? I can't wait for examples!
You are reading and writing what you want. You fail to mention that Nissan TOLD Car and Driver that they had a preproduction test mule! And Car and Driver printed that too. There was no "trying to get accross", or "implication"....it was black and white. ![]() It's a damn shame really that we auto fanatics are even squabling about this. I would bet $$$ every major magaziine was begging Nissan to let them test drive something (even a test mule) so they could have a great headlining story. That is more likely of a scenario than Nissan actively deceiving the press IMHO.
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#26 (permalink) | |
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7.0 Liter LS7 V8
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: In front of my computer
Drives: 2006 HHR
2002 Corolla-Before I saw the light
Posts: 8,058
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
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Before Understanding comes Faith "Legislatures represent people, not acres or trees"-Earl Warren |
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#27 (permalink) | |
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3.6 Liter V6
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,061
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
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#28 (permalink) | |
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3.6 Liter V6
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,061
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
Quote:
If that was GM people would be calling quality control issues, if it was Porsche it would be character, and with Nissan it is individually crafted perfection. American manufacturers gets the stick again. |
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#29 (permalink) | |
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6.2 Liter Vortec V8
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,510
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
Quote:
Also, remember the first GT-R that was tested, was not a car Nissan sent to a journalist. It was a PRODUCTION car (albeit JDM) that was owned by someone, that volunteered to let Edmunds test it. |
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#30 (permalink) |
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5.3 Liter LS4 V8
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: CT
Drives: 2005 chevy silverado 1500 5.3 EC LB Z-71
Posts: 3,251
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Re: Caranddriver: More on the GT-R's real horsepower
not to mention with the way gm works the second batch will probably have more content and options and be of better quality overall.
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2005 Chevy Silverado 1500 5.3 Z-71 EC LB 3" P.A. Body lift, 305/70/17 Nitto Terra Grapplers, 17x9 Pro Comp Extreme Alloy Wheels, Halo Projector headlights w/ HID conversion and LEDs, halo projector fog lights, Pace Edwards tonneau cover, Fire and Ice LED light bar, "Patriot" back window decal, JDM black chrome bumper lights w/ LED, Putco Crhome handle covers, Billet-grille emblem, iPOD jack... |
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