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Cadillac CT8 Will be the Brand's First True Flagship in the Modern Era

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#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Cadillac CT8 Will be the Brand's First True Flagship in the Modern Era
Automobilemag

June 19, 2015


What We Know
The 2016 CT6 is not Cadillac’s flagship, General Motors product chief Mark Reuss says. That role will be given to an even larger rear-wheel-drive sedan coming within four years. While the Cadillac CT6 is a bit bigger than a short-wheelbase BMW 7 Series, we expect the so-called CT8 to be slightly larger than the long-wheelbase Mercedes-Benz S-Class. The CT8, like the CT6, will ride on the new Omega platform, which employs GM’s patented process for welding aluminum. If the CT6 is any guide, the CT8 will be hundreds of pounds lighter than the S-Class.

Why It Matters
Although it doesn’t show on sales charts, Cadillac is enjoying a renaissance thanks to new models that match or beat their BMW and Mercedes-Benz rivals on many metrics. The CT8 promises to take these advances even further, making this car worthy of a window sticker that reads $95,000 or higher.

Potential Pitfalls
As much as Cadillac has improved, it has yet to achieve Lexus-like overall quality or Audi-like interior execution. The CT8 must do both. Specifically, its new engines must idle more smoothly than the engines we’ve experienced in the ATS and CTS, and the CUE infotainment system must respond quicker to user inputs.

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#2 ·
Yet another comparison between future Cadillacs that customers can't actually buy now and comparing them to cars developed a few years ago and already in the showrooms and selling well.

If you want to compare next-generation Cadillacs, then compare them with next-generation Audi, BMW and Mercedes-Benz models to make it a realistic comparison.
 
#3 ·
My non-expert advice for Cadillac:

First, don't worry about how directly it fares against the S-Class, LS, or anything else. Buyers shopping for your product want a large Cadillac, not S-Class By Cadillac or 7-Series By Cadillac. If they want that type of car they'll buy it. You have to draw them in based on other elements. Style will be one of them, significantly so. Make the Ciel Concept into a sedan, sized like a Maybach 57. Larger than the import luxury sedans and far more brash, the Omega platform would keep its weight from getting excessive yet its brawny looks and size would give it considerable presence.

Secondly, details are immensely crucial to this car's success. The knobs, switches, and surfaces must be second to none. At minimum they must be as good as the new 7-Series and S-Class.

Thirdly, technology is paramount. As fantastic as the new Omega platform appears to be, its shock value if you will is now complete that it's been unveiled on another vehicle. So just as BMW has the new gesture functions and Lexus had the self-park on the 2007 LS, etc, the CT8 must have distinguishing features and technologies, not just "all of the above". Technology is another thing that can make the vehicle distinctive from the various other large sedans that are available. Whether you file this under technology or details, things like door handles even are perfect for individuality. The Tesla Model S or CTS Coupe have had ideas for this specific detail, but obviously this goes far beyond door handles.

Fourth, the volume powertrains all must be available at launch. A CT8-V or CT8 V-12 should be launched later to maintain interest in the product, but V-8 for example needs to be available right away.

Fifth, unique options must be available. Platinum is not enough. Lexus in Japan has L-Select, Mercedes has Designo, etc.
 
#10 ·
My non-expert advice for Cadillac:
First, don't worry about how directly it fares against the S-Class, LS, or anything else. Buyers shopping for your product want a large Cadillac, not S-Class By Cadillac or 7-Series By Cadillac. If they want that type of car they'll buy it. You have to draw them in based on other elements. Style will be one of them, significantly so. Make the Ciel Concept into a sedan, sized like a Maybach 57. Larger than the import luxury sedans and far more brash, the Omega platform would keep its weight from getting excessive yet its brawny looks and size would give it considerable presence.
Secondly, details are immensely crucial to this car's success. The knobs, switches, and surfaces must be second to none. At minimum they must be as good as the new 7-Series and S-Class.
Thirdly, technology is paramount. As fantastic as the new Omega platform appears to be, its shock value if you will is now complete that it's been unveiled on another vehicle. So just as BMW has the new gesture functions and Lexus had the self-park on the 2007 LS, etc, the CT8 must have distinguishing features and technologies, not just "all of the above". Technology is another thing that can make the vehicle distinctive from the various other large sedans that are available. Whether you file this under technology or details, things like door handles even are perfect for individuality. The Tesla Model S or CTS Coupe have had ideas for this specific detail, but obviously this goes far beyond door handles.
Fourth, the volume powertrains all must be available at launch. A CT8-V or CT8 V-12 should be launched later to maintain interest in the product, but V-8 for example needs to be available right away.
Fifth, unique options must be available. Platinum is not enough. Lexus in Japan has L-Select, Mercedes has Designo, etc.
Make it the best looking sedan ever, that looks like a million bucks but only costs 100k or so! More special than any of the great Cadillacs of its storied past
 
#28 ·
V-12 engines have historically been in limited production high priced vehicles, that has pretty much always been a part of the V-12 business case. As such there is certainly reasons to build a V-12 engine, however I wonder how V-12 engines are regulated in the EU market going forward. Are there exceptions for limited production vehicles which would allow a 400+BHP N/A V-12 engine?.
 
#30 ·
As far as the Europe is concerned, full EU Type Approval has to be obtained, but corporate fuel consumption targets have to be achieved, or surcharges paid, so there's no legislative hurdle particularly applicable to high capacity engines - but given that the best V8s are pushing 600bhp, then any V12 would need to be pushing 1000, not 400.
 
#47 ·
The case for continuing to build an existing engine is pretty easy to make
To spend $600 million on a limited production engine that you would sell in the dozens or low hundreds is far more problematic. What would you need to charge for a $600 million dollar engine that you would sell 50-200 a year?
 
#59 ·
This is all very nice, but personally I feel Cadillac needs the crossovers in showrooms before anything like the CT8.
 
#66 ·
The problem with CT8 being the first "modern flagship" is WTF is CT6 doing in the lineup?

Having just been in Monaco this entire day, you experience what the top 1% of the 1% really have. It's the conspicuous wealth.
As I drove into Monaco, trailing a Quattorporte, the first set of cars parked on the side were... S-Class, S-Class, S-Class, S-Class, S-Class, S-Class, S-Class, A8, V-Class, S-Class, S-Class. It was one of those WTF moments. Not to mention the sheer number of Ferraris, Astons, Rolls, Bentleys, Lamborghinis, Porsches, Maseratis.

Strangely, no 7-series and few A8's, but a good number of R8's.

More than ever, I truly believe that the only way for Cadillac to make any significant inroads in the luxury market is to earn the right to be in high end places like Monaco. Or Saint Tropez. Or Cannes.

The dominant car in these status seeking, glitzy places? The S-Class.

It is the car to beat.
We all can talk HP, weight, and what not. But the ultimate test is in status and prestige.
CT 8 can best the S in every metric. It just won't matter unless that metric is prestige and recognition.
 
#67 ·
The problem with CT8 being the first "modern flagship" is WTF is CT6 doing in the lineup?
Member ENGLEMAN, who seems to have an inside contact, has stated several times that the CT6 is essentially a replacement for the XTS.
 
#74 ·
Prediction :CT6 won't sell well enough to green light the CT8 it will never be built..... The board will fire Johan in 2years because Cadillac sales will trend sideways... While Lincoln with new Cuv, Suv, and Continental increase sales at 20% of Cadillac investment....
 
#80 · (Edited)
The board and investors are looking at the long game. Trucks can't sell forever. FCA is clearly desperate because all the money on the hood is killing them and can't make enough money to reinvest in R&D. Which is why they're spinning off Ferrari. FCA's margin is <5% which is terrible from an investor's point of view. GM is at roughly 9%
 
#111 ·
^ And thusly your singular opinion is, for the umpteenth time, duly noted. :/

I have no issue with either, but it would be lauded by some folk if 'Cadillac would just be Cadillac' and polish up a heritage nameplate for a top-shelf car. At least..., I think that's what they mean when they whine that sentiment. ;)
 
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