My ideal Pontiac lineup (Update 13)

[AmericanRevolution]

Originally Posted by Arcsvibe

Lineups look great but the Vibe could use some more HPs! I would say base models 180 HPs and the GT versions 250 HPs...nothing wrong with a little dreaming

If you're refering to my lineup, take a look at what I said about the Vibe...

[AmericanRevolution]

Originally Posted by IAMCANADIAN

FIREBIRD
7.0L 500 HP V8 GTP
8.1L 620 HP V8 TRANS-AM

Isn't that a bit outta Firebird's traditional league of being one or two steps above the 'maro?

EDIT: OMG!!! *pounds head on desk multiple times* I can't believe I forgot to add in the Firebird to my list!!!

There, updated, tne FB is added!

[IAMCANADIAN]

Originally Posted by AmericanRevolution

Isn't that a bit outta Firebird's traditional league of being one or two steps above the 'maro?

EDIT: OMG!!! *pounds head on desk multiple times* I can't believe I forgot to add in the Firebird to my list!!!

There, updated, tne FB is added!

I felt that Pontiac needed to be the power leader and i decided to make the GM TRUCK 8.1L V8 an addition but with 620 HP hell even 600 HP is more than enough, something that chevy wouldn't be allowed to offer and of course and all the V8's will have DOD and the mild hybrid found in the trucks.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by AmericanRevolution

Isn't that a bit outta Firebird's traditional league of being one or two steps above the 'maro?

EDIT: OMG!!! *pounds head on desk multiple times* I can't believe I forgot to add in the Firebird to my list!!!

There, updated, tne FB is added!

What's the use of having a Firebird, when you have the GTO in teh lineup??
I think Solstice and GTO cover much of the lineup already.

If Firebird would ever be resurrected, I would see it as a near-Corvette car... to be sold in the $40K range.

Solstice -- $20K range.
GTO -- $30K range.
Firebird -- $40K range.

[Arcsvibe]

Originally Posted by AmericanRevolution

If you're refering to my lineup, take a look at what I said about the Vibe...

My bad! Sorry about that

[AmericanRevolution]

Originally Posted by Arcsvibe

My bad! Sorry about that

lol, np prob just missed what I said...

[AmericanRevolution]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

What's the use of having a Firebird, when you have the GTO in teh lineup??
I think Solstice and GTO cover much of the lineup already.

If Firebird would ever be resurrected, I would see it as a near-Corvette car... to be sold in the $40K range.

Solstice -- $20K range.
GTO -- $30K range.
Firebird -- $40K range.

I'm seeing it as a step below the GTO... less expensive (though more so by a little over the 'maro), less powerful, and less performance... a stronger pony car vs. a 450 hp muscle car... (big!) advantage: GTO.

But, that's how I got it in my lineup...

[gmsickofan]

Originally Posted by GM_Fanatic

oh I definetly have no argument with you on the Torrent but in GM's defense I think the Equinox is a good looking vehicle and a simple rebadge will sell. Crazy people like us might be disappointed at something thats not 100% Pontiac but regardless it should still sell.

Don't encourage those bean-counters!

[AmericanRevolution]

Originally Posted by gmsickofan

Don't encourage those bean-counters!

[acascianelli]

Here is my take at this...

Solstice
base: 2.4L ecotec 170hp , same as current
gxp: 2.0L 205+hp supercharged ecotec, same motor used in cobalt ss and redline ion.
:: 5spd, gxp model should get distinctive styling like other gxp models, RWD only.

Vibe
Base: 1.8L 130hp (same as current base)
GT: 1.8L 180hp (same as current GT)
GXP: 1.8L sc 210hp (same as current GT)
:: Introduce a GXP model. I know there is an aftermarket supercharger that can be purchased from pontiac for the 130hp vibe but not the GT, a GXP model should have the 180hp motor supercharged. Currently the Vibe with AWD only comes with the 130hp motor. i think it should be made available only to all models including GT, and GXP.

G6
Base: 2.2L 145hp Ecotec
GT: 3.5L 200hp
GXP: 3.9L 240hp
:: This platform is too small for a v8 motors, i think they should offer the gt and base models in a 5spd, and the gxp with the 6spd. Keep it FWD, this car is too heavy to gain even more weight from a AWD system.

Grand Prix
Base: 3.8L N/A
GT: 3.8L SC 260hp, eliminate the GTP model and give the GT model the SC motor and TapShift option.
GXP: 5.3L 305hp
:: This platform would not hold up with a ls2 or any other sbc motor in it. leave it auto trans with the tapshift. as much as i dont want to say it, it would be in gm's best interested to keep it 4door only. the g6 gxp will fill the gap that the 2door gtp left. Leave it FWD, extra weight would hurt its performance too much.

GTO
Base 6.0L 400hp
GXP 7.0L 500hp
:: expect Base model to be 30-35k and gxp around 40k. dont expect a race ready suspension like the z06, gm would do this because it would hurt corvette and z06 sales. RWD only, you wont see AWD in this for the same reason that you wont see a z06 or corvette quality suspension. optional Judge trimming would be nice too.

Bonneville
Base: 3.8L
SSE: 3.8L SC 260hp
GXP: 4.6L northstar 320hp
:: no manual, the 4t60 and 4t85 is good enough. FWD, with AWD available on GXP model, that is if they have a AWD setup for it.

Torrent
Base: 3.5L 200hp
GXP: 3.9L 240hp
:: This platform is too small for a V8, leave it as automatic but possibly add sport shifting like in the auto g6 gt. Hopefully the Torrent will replace the Aztek. FWD with optional AWD on all models.

Montana
Base: 3.5L 200hp
SV6: 3.9L 240hp, awd.
:: no gxp label, gxp supposed to be high performance cars, not minivans. FWD with AWD on SV6 model.

UPCOMING MODELS

G4
Base: 2.2L 145hp ecotec
GXP: 2.0L 205hp supercharged ecotec, pontiac trimmed cobalt ss, enough said.
:: The G4 will most likely be VERY similar to the existing cobalt and ion. expect this around 2007-2008. available in 2 and 4 doors, 5 speed and auto. base price around 15k, gxp model around 21-22k. FWD Only.

G8
Base: 3.8L
SSE: 3.8L SC
GXP: 4.6L northstar 320hp
:: replacement for bonneville. 4 or 5 speed auto with sport shift. FWD, with AWD available on GXP model, that is if they have a AWD setup for it. Expect this around 2008-2009.

theres no reason for them to come back with a firebird when they allready offer a sports car, the GTO. i believe they should come out with factory backed aftermarket like MOPAR. There is alot of potential in the 3.8sc, 2.0c, LS2, and 5.3l. i dont think GM will come out with any twin turbo configurations in this decade or ever, its just not practical and reliable enough. i also doubt they will be introducing any single turbo motors, superchargers are working just fine in theyre supercharged motors, but i wouldnt expect to see any factory supercharged v8's tho. my view is pretty realistic and only changes little things about the current lineup.

i compare pontiacs lineup to companies such as bmw. here's an example...

Solstice = Z4
G6 = 3xx
Grand Prix = 5xx
Bonneville/G8 = 8xx
GTO = 6xx
Vibe = X3
Torrent = X5

dont look at the comparisons as competetive but more as a comparison of where the car fits in the market.

[AmericanRevolution]

Originally Posted by acascianelli

Here is my take at this...



theres no reason for them to come back with a firebird when they allready offer a sports car, the GTO. i believe they should come out with factory backed aftermarket like MOPAR. There is alot of potential in the 3.8sc, 2.0c, LS2, and 5.3l. i dont think GM will come out with any twin turbo configurations in this decade or ever, its just not practical and reliable enough. i also doubt they will be introducing any single turbo motors, superchargers are working just fine in theyre supercharged motors, but i wouldnt expect to see any factory supercharged v8's tho. my view is pretty realistic and only changes little things about the current lineup.

i compare pontiacs lineup to companies such as bmw. here's an example...

Solstice = Z4
G6 = 3xx
Grand Prix = 5xx
Bonneville/G8 = 8xx
GTO = 6xx
Vibe = X3
Torrent = X5

dont look at the comparisons as competetive but more as a comparison of where the car fits in the market.

Umm.. no... GTO is NOT a sports car... it's a muscle car... Corvette is a sports car... BIG difference...

The Firebird would go under the GTO w/ less power and lower price (though above the 'maro) as a sporty and fast 2+2 pony car... the GTO, a 2+2 muscle coupe (no sedan) with gobs more power and luxury over the Firebird...

EDIT: I also notice in your lineup, you're using the current cars? What I'm looking as is basically scratching also all of them, getting them set up on RWD/AWD platforms, and much better, more aggressive without being '90s Pontiac distinctive... more bold than and aggressive instead of what we've seen in the '90s up until what we are now begining to see...

[citric acid]

Makes a lot more sense than the Chevrolet lineup, since your obvious (and understandable) love of performance works with the Pontiac line better than it does with Chevrolet. I also agree there is a place for both the Firebird and the GTO. My one concern is that having every line have a coupe and convertible could crowd car lines of the more sporting versions.

[AmericanRevolution]

Updated just about every car... two of the convertible's have been taken off.

[AmericanRevolution]

The Grand Prix has been taken out, though it could return in the near future...

[AmericanRevolution]

Umm.. I'd put hybrid as an OPTION, not standard on all engines... would you want a T/A V8 hybrid Firebird? I didn't think so...