My/Your Ideal BPGmc ± ? lineup

[K Dawg ONE]

How about keeping Chevy-Caddy as a 'singular brand' and PBGS as the alternative to the 'singular brandd' and becomes 'GM Collection' or just General Motors? Basically, GM would be down to two channels.

General Motors (with GM being the brand, the PBGS being the modle, and then the trim level):
GM Saturn 'Z' (hybrid hatch - Delta)
GM Saturn 'S' (hybrid small sedan - Delta)
GM Saturn 'L' (hybrid full/mid sedan -EpII)
GM Pontiac 'G2' (2 door coupe/4 door hatch - Delta)
GM Pontiac 'G4' (mid-size sedan - EpII)
GM Pontiac 'Solstice' (2 seat convertable - Kappa)
GM Pontiac 'Firebird' (2+2 Sports Coupe - Zeta)
GM Buick 'Regal' (lux mid-size - Sigma)
GM Buick 'Park Avenue' (lux full-size - Zeta)
GM Buick 'Enclave' (full size cross-over SUV - Theta Premium or Theta-Epsilon)
GMC 'Sonoma' (x-cab pickup - Theta)
GMC 'Sierra' (same configs as now, minus Denali and hybrid)
GMC 'Terrain' (entry level cross-over SUV - Theta)
GMC 'Yukon Denali' (full size cross-over SUV - Lambda II)

Chevy-Caddy would be:
Chevrolet 'Beat' (compact 3 door hatch - GMDAT-M / M300)
Chevrolet 'Cavalier' (3 door hatch/4 door compact sedan - Delta)
Chevrolet 'Malibu' (mid-size sedan - EpII)
Chevrolet 'Impala' (full size sedan - Zeta)
Chevrolet 'Camaro' (2+2 Sports Coupe - Zeta)
Chevrolet 'S10' (x-cab pickup - Theta)
Chevrolet 'Silverado' (same configs as now)
Chevrolet 'Equinox' (entry level cross-over SUV - Theta)
Chevrolet 'Tahoe' (full size cross-over SUV - Lambda II)
Caddy 'CTS' (lux mid-size - Sigma)
Caddy 'DTS' (lux full-size - Zeta)
Caddy 'XLR' (2 seater Sports Coupe - Zeta)
Caddy 'ESV' (full size cross-over SUV - Lambda II)

[Uzzy]

I'll admit, I didn't read the whole tread. I hardly read any of it, but I did catch one thing that I had to comment on. Your idea of recycling the Electra name for a premium Volt...Genius! I love that!

[2b2]

Thanks, Uzzy
thought using 'Electra' (And having a Buick-Volt) would be sorta inevitable...
and Buick's higher price-range would help with the higher initial costs for the plug-in system
&
if you see this reply - the Readers'Digest version is in post#2
but
here's a sorta updated list (borrowing most truck-stuff & platform names from HVM's recent post, any mistakes are mine)

Buick /pkgs___________
Pk.Ave /Bonneville___(Zeta lwb sedan)
Insignia /GrandPrix___(Epi2 sedan)
Enclave ___________.(Lambda CUV)
Electra____________.(Lux Volt)

Saturn /pkgs_________
Ion /Tempest,Excelle__(Delta2 sedan)
Astra /LeMans,Excelle_(Delta2 hatches)
Vibe / ?,Excelle______(Delta2 MPV)
Corsa / ?,'B'_________(Gamma2 hatches)
Atom / ?,'B' _________(A/B-class hatches)
Vue / -,Century?______(Theta CUV?)

Pontiac /pkgs________
G8 /LeSabre?Riviera?_(Zeta swb 4-door/vert)
Torana /Riviera______(Alpha? 5-door/Cabrio)
Solstice /Sky?_______(Kappa2 coupé/targa)

GMC /pkgs____________
Yukon /Denali,H9____(GMT-900 fullsize SUV)
Sierra /Denali,'H'____(GMT-900 fullsize p/u)
Envoy /Denali,H7____(GMT-700 midsize SUV)
Sonoma /Denali,'H'__.(GMT-700 midsize p/u)
'G-MaC'/Denali,H5__.(? Jeep-replacement)
__.''______________.(? ^ compact p/u version)

[Bravada]

2b2 - from what I can gather Zeta and Alpha have been merged, i.e. the Zeta will be replaced by a smaller, lighter version of itself. I don't quite get all that "pkgs" kerfuffle (Pk. Ave is Bonneville, while G8 is Riviera....?)

Where's Chevrolet then? Which models are being shared with Opel and/or Holden? Getting rid of Saab just because you can't figure out what to do with it is not a nice thing to do :P

My my, have I got critical of everything today. I am so pretty and witty and all :p

Your idea of recycling the Electra name for a premium Volt...Genius! I love that!

I've been proposing that since 1984 or so :p

[2b2]

I didn't know about the Zeta and Alpha merger
but afaik Zeta was designed to be several sizes - would expect the nextgen-combo to still have that capability

Originally Posted by Bravada

I don't quite get all that "pkgs" kerfuffle (Pk. Ave is Bonneville, while G8 is Riviera....?)

Where's Chevrolet then? Which models are being shared with Opel and/or Holden? Getting rid of Saab just because you can't figure out what to do with it is not a nice thing to do :P

My my, have I got critical of everything today. I am so pretty and witty and all :p

sorry I'm too short on time to explain better...
the packages come from NOT having 3 (or even 2) different versions of the same car - since I'm advocating joining Saturn with B&P&Gmc
While doing away with (semi)duplicated models
until/if I find the time (assuming you're really interested)... did you check out the webpage I made?

[CadiEldo67]

This is an interesting take on what GM can do to cut down the overlapping models. But, (not saying my idea is better than yours) using my idea of keeping the brands the same, just reducing the number of models within each cost little to nothing.

[Uzzy]

Originally Posted by CadiEldo67

This is an interesting take on what GM can do to cut down the overlapping models. But, (not saying my idea is better than yours) using my idea of keeping the brands the same, just reducing the number of models within each cost little to nothing.

That is what I think should be done as well, but the problem is when all but Chevy and Cadillac become niche brands with only 2 or 3 models, how do the dealerships make money selling and servicing them? I don't think that GM can really re-focus their brands properly, until all brands are sold at a uni-fied mega dealer.

[2b2]

Originally Posted by Uzzy

...but the problem is when all but Chevy and Cadillac become niche brands with only 2 or 3 models, how do the dealerships make money selling and servicing them?..

by having "all but Chevy & Cadillac" in one sales channel/dealer

Originally Posted by CadiEldo67

This is an interesting take on what GM can do to cut down the overlapping models. But, (not saying my idea is better than yours) using my idea of keeping the brands the same, just reducing the number of models within each cost little to nothing.

actually I thought our proposals were much more similar than different
that's why I brought this to your attention
&
wanted to include a Link to your "Redundancy: see General Motors" thread here, too

Originally Posted by Bravada

...I don't quite get all that "pkgs" kerfuffle (Pk. Ave is Bonneville, while G8 is Riviera....?)

re-visiting this thread (don't know if you will, Mr.B ), I'm wondering if a large part of your kerfuffling is that the larger Zeta is first & foremost a Buick, while the smaller Z is mainly identitified with Pontiac...
if so
those size & role differences ARE the reasons:
the sportier one = Pontiac
larger/cushier-cruiser = Buick

but because I'm looking at BPGmc+S as one Brand
there are no styling differences (except for grille inserts)
& all top-Lux packages at the Brand are under the "Buick range", while the top-performance trims fall under Pontiacs


(good excuse to re-post)

insignia
powered by Pontiac

...just the top-HP model-trim ( = kerfuffle) which would replace all G6's

&
Link to PontiacBixler's superior chop (tho possibly with more differentiation than I recommend)

[Uzzy]

Originally Posted by 2b2

by having "all but Chevy & Cadillac" in one sales channel/dealer

I would still like to have them at one site, but keep things separate, and add Buick, SAAB and possibly HUMMER to Caddy. Different building and staff, but same place.

[CadiEldo67]

Originally Posted by 2b2

actually I thought our proposals were much more similar than different

We do have a similar idea, but I was giving Saturn a back to basics lineup, with smaller cars that just happened to be more premium than their Chevrolet counterparts. Buick has larger vehicles and would without a doubt overtake Pontiac in the sales race between the brands. Pontiac would have just a few vehicles that were worth being Pontiacs.

Then again, several members have pointed out that pairing down the brands to 2-3 models that all supplement each other is difficult and its hard to tell which cars will make the cut and still keep a balance within the brands to justify their existence.

[2b2]

Originally Posted by CadiEldo67

...several members have pointed out that pairing down the brands to 2-3 models that all supplement each other is difficult and its hard to tell which cars will make the cut and still keep a balance within the brands to justify their existence.

yeah - that's why, *specifically for Pontiac* I had that 'packages' idea -- that Pontiac would "get credit for" the top-performing models that are primarily marketed as Saturns & Buicks (& which wouldn't 'deserve' to be Pontiacs [imho] in their less powerful versions)

[CadiEldo67]

I think that would be too confusing for anyone besides enthusiast. I've done some stupid things but I've come to the realization that the general public isn't that intelligent. I'm not one to pat myself on the back but seriously.

Pontiac would probably be best with an Insignia coupe, a Solstice, and a G8. It should keep the Insignia name, and the G8 should become Grand Prix.

[2b2]

update:
just cross out S a t u r n
and write in O p e l

[artrix]

Not bad, i haven' seen this thread before, maybe later i'll form and add my own lineup here.

[ausrutherford]

Chevy:
Spark
Aveo
Cruze
Malibu
Impala
HHR
Orlando
Trax-city crossover
Tracker-sub compact crossover
Captiva-compact crossover
Nox
Traverse
Colorado
Silvy
Avalache
Suburban
Express

Buick:
Agila
Corsa
Skylark-Astra
Regal
LaCrosse
Rainier-sub compact crossover
Vue
Enclave
Tigra

GMC:
Terrain
Acadia
Yukon
Tornado-sub compact truck
Sierra
Canyon-XT Denali
Combo
Savanna-One of those big Opel vans