10 vehicles that will redefine the auto industry in the next year. Agree or disagree

[davidlane]

Includes 2 GM vehicles

From hybrids to big pickups, from luxury cars to thrifty compacts, a handful of new vehicles that debut over the next 12 months may shape the future of automakers around the world.

They come in all shapes and sizes. Some break new ground for their manufacturers. Others aim to reassert companies' dominance in market segments they created.

From icons like the Ford F-150 and Toyota Prius to newcomers like the Lincoln MKT and Chevrolet Traverse, they are the most interesting and important new cars to watch as the 2009 model year kicks into high gear and model year 2010 begins.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...014/BUSINESS01

[mikmak]

I really like the look of that Venza. It is going to do very well.

[eurohazard]

2009 Audi A4: Disagree
The article says: "price of $32,700 for the sedan and $34,500 for the station wagon should make competitors from Acura to Lexus nervous." Acura nor Lexus makes a wagon. And the sedans are about the same price once equipped the same way. A4 a nice looking car though!

2009 Chevrolet Traverse: Disagree
Sorry guys, I know this is GMI and all, but many of you will agree with me in wondering "where is the groundbreaking" if there is already 3 versions of this thing?

2010 Chevrolet Camaro: Agree....
Sort of. This car seems to be the pick of the pony cars.....and no doubt could challenge cars like a G37 and maybe a 3 series for a buyer that is looking at performance value and not snob-quotient. It seems to be taking forever to get here......everyone's mouth was watering when Transformers came out. By the time the car arrives, some people are going to think, "meh".

2009 Dodge Ram: Agree
If the rear suspension is half as good as Dodge thinks it is...then this could be the future of 1/2 ton trucks.

2009 Ford F-150: Disagree
The truck doesn't seem to offer anything groundbreaking. But when Ecoboost comes...that could be a different story.

2010 Honda Insight: Maybe
It'll impress me if there's enough built to meet demand, and prices stay as low as the rumors (sub $20k).

2010 Lincoln MKT: Maybe
Is this thing going to based on the Taurus/500 platform like the Flex? The ecoboost and styling are what is making me say "maybe".

2009 Toyota Venza: Disagree
It looks like an Avalon wagon. Big whoop. I can't wait to see how slow that big MF'er will be with it's base I4 engine.

2010 Toyota Prius: Maybe
Oh yeah, it's the car everyone at GMI hates...but no one can deny the popularity. I don't think Toyota is just going to rest on their laurels.

2009 Mazda 6: Agree......
Sort of. This car will shake up the midsize segment more than anything since the 2002 Altima, but is that saying a whole lot? People will like the styling (even though I don't), and the performance is there.......but if Mazda is serious about "zoom zoom" they need 6MT for I4 and V6!!!

[likearock00]

The only vehicle that I see as "redefining" the industry is the Dodge with it's rear suspension. Although it's old technology, I see this to be a vast improvement over leaf spring suspension. All the other vehicles are nice, but are not groundbreaking by any stretch of the imagination. That'll be left to the Volt whenever it debuts.


I think they did a poor job of titleing this article. It should say something like "Great new products that could really boost the manufacturer".

[SirRaven]

^^^

Ya none of those will REDEFINE the auto industry. Maybe set some newer standards and raise the bar, but they are all just improvements off of cars already out there. Now once electric cars, Fuel cells, and plug-ins, those will start to redefine the auto industry.

To redefine something you need to have something come along out of the box. So radically different than anything else out there that it not only creates new standards, but a whole way of thinking and a different class. Hondas FCX and the Equinox Fuel cell are along those lines, but neither is at a mass production point. The Volt is the closest on a mass production point, but still years off. Maybe the Prius/Vue/Escape plug ins, but those are almost more of just starting your hybrid at a full state of charge all the time and not all that radically different.

[PhishPhood]

Yes poorly titled article.

To me redefining means everybody sits up, says 'Wow' or 'Oh ***, How did we miss that?'

The Ram rear suspension is potentially a great advancement, however this segment is withering away with every boost in fuel prices. In 2001 this would have been remarkable and Dodge would have had a solid 10 yrs of smooth riding so to speak. Now with Chrysler's disappearance from the landscape and the truck segment shrinking before our eyes IMO it's a 'nice feature, but meh.'

How can the Volt not be on the list? The Honda Clarity? The Vue Fuel Cell? Redefining the auto industry is what the Prius did in 2003. We may not even have any idea what's on the design boards for say 2014 and beyond.

[Bravada]

Note to editors: auto industry exists outside of North America.

As concerns "potentially redefining" vehicles:

A4 - somewhat, because of the platform, but the A5 had it first and is much more "redefining"

Traverse - nothing to add to what Eurohazard said

Camaro - Mustang was "redefining", Challenger and Camaro are just followers

Ram - don't care or know enough about pickups, but it could be Chrysler's saving grace after GM's pickups got forgettable and Ford's ugly

F-150 - only if it debuts the ecoboost engine - and the engine is groundbreaking, could've debuted in the Fiesta

Insight - yes, if under $20K

MKT - if this fat walrus sells well, it will "redefine", as it is currently sorta "class of it own"

Venza - what's new *****cat, actually? The fact that it's the first mainstream new line from Toyota for North America in years isn't really redefining.

Prius - first was redefining, second was somewhat redefining... but what's new about the 2010?

Mazda 6 - the first Atenza was indeed redefining - for Mazda. The second one is a good sequel, but what's new?


I am afraid the next year is not qoing to be very "redefining" for the automotive industry in North America, and not so much for the world, unless SAIC debuts the Roewe 550 worldwide and it doesn't flop.

[Michael_S]

Originally Posted by eurohazard

2009 Audi A4: Disagree
The article says: "price of $32,700 for the sedan and $34,500 for the station wagon should make competitors from Acura to Lexus nervous." Acura nor Lexus makes a wagon. And the sedans are about the same price once equipped the same way. A4 a nice looking car though!

2009 Chevrolet Traverse: Disagree
Sorry guys, I know this is GMI and all, but many of you will agree with me in wondering "where is the groundbreaking" if there is already 3 versions of this thing?

2010 Chevrolet Camaro: Agree....
Sort of. This car seems to be the pick of the pony cars.....and no doubt could challenge cars like a G37 and maybe a 3 series for a buyer that is looking at performance value and not snob-quotient. It seems to be taking forever to get here......everyone's mouth was watering when Transformers came out. By the time the car arrives, some people are going to think, "meh".

2009 Dodge Ram: Agree
If the rear suspension is half as good as Dodge thinks it is...then this could be the future of 1/2 ton trucks.

2009 Ford F-150: Disagree
The truck doesn't seem to offer anything groundbreaking. But when Ecoboost comes...that could be a different story.

2010 Honda Insight: Maybe
It'll impress me if there's enough built to meet demand, and prices stay as low as the rumors (sub $20k).

2010 Lincoln MKT: Maybe
Is this thing going to based on the Taurus/500 platform like the Flex? The ecoboost and styling are what is making me say "maybe".

2009 Toyota Venza: Disagree
It looks like an Avalon wagon. Big whoop. I can't wait to see how slow that big MF'er will be with it's base I4 engine.

2010 Toyota Prius: Maybe
Oh yeah, it's the car everyone at GMI hates...but no one can deny the popularity. I don't think Toyota is just going to rest on their laurels.

2009 Mazda 6: Agree......
Sort of. This car will shake up the midsize segment more than anything since the 2002 Altima, but is that saying a whole lot? People will like the styling (even though I don't), and the performance is there.......but if Mazda is serious about "zoom zoom" they need 6MT for I4 and V6!!!

I agree with you on all points.

I've driven the 2007 Chevy Malibu 4-cylinder with its 145 horsepower engine and 4 speed automatic, and acceleration in that was perfectly fine. I wouldn't try to race anyone, but my life wasn't in danger either. The Toyota Venza 4-cylinder will have a slightly better power-to-weight ratio than that.

[AMERICA 123]

One of the most 'redefining' automotive changes for Calender Year 2009 in the USA market will be the re introduction of a small but usable amount of Light Diesel product choices as well as whatever other new (or significantly 'renewed') powertrain choices come on line and are compelling - such as anything Plug in etc.

By the metric used in this article, the Jetta Sportwagon Clean Diesel would have to bump something off the existing list - for a time now there has not been a choice offered here with that kind of space combined with that kind of fuel cost - never mind the enjoyment factor.

[calgaryhhr]

Originally Posted by AMERICA 123

One of the most 'redefining' automotive changes for Calender Year 2009 in the USA market will be the re introduction of a small but usable amount of Light Diesel product choices as well as whatever other new (or significantly 'renewed') powertrain choices come on line and are compelling - such as anything Plug in etc.

By the metric used in this article, the Jetta Sportwagon Clean Diesel would have to bump something off the existing list - for a time now there has not been a choice offered here with that kind of space combined with that kind of fuel cost - never mind the enjoyment factor.

I agree with this. I think a rejuvenation of the diesel powertrain in passenger cars will be somewhat redefining (at least more so than the introduction of the Traverse and other things vehicles listed above.)

VW clean diesel technology and Mercedes Bluetec will likely lead to a development in diesel as an option for more vehicles. I think the Asians are working on diesels for Acura vehicles (if I'm not mistaken) and you can bet that Volvo will likely introduce new diesel technology at some point as well.

Looking at 2009 for any major changes is a little short sighted. The big revolutions will likely start in 2011 or 2012. This is the time frame when many battery-electric assisted vehicles should be coming to market. Vehicles like the Volt, plug in Prius, Mitsubishi i-Miev, Nissan and Mazda models and whatever else is in development behind closed doors.

These will be the game changers and the technological marvels that should set the industry down a different path.

[johnstarnes]

Originally Posted by mikmak

I really like the look of that Venza. It is going to do very well.

I like it too.....quite innovative looking, wagonesque.

[calgaryhhr]

I forgot to mention that I would also add the Subaru PZEV line up to the list. I don't know how long they have been available in the US (if they are) but I saw the Legacy PZEV for the first time this year at my local auto show.

[AMERICA 123]

calgaryhhr,

For non technical reasons ( ie no assumption of technical superiority - or even parity), and with more than a little ( bitter?) irony, Honda's NA diesel offerings are going to matter, and matter a great deal.

( Acura's continued misdirection may smudge that up a bit, but hey, who knows ? )

IF we count Audi's soon to be offered product in with VWs - and MB etc - its possible - compression ignition is going to have a decent enough year in NA 2009 that it stands afightin' chance against battery this and that going forward.

Looking at 2009 for any major changes is a little short sighted. The big revolutions will likely start in 2011 or 2012.

YEP.

Its not just going to be about one specific product group or technology.

For all, its pretty much ( roughly captured ) by 2007 plus 5, and 2008 plus 5.

Regardless, a very important 'side issue' is that (most) 2009/2010 and earlier product is going to get stale - real quick.

This is quite likely to be the most dramatic shift of this type in the history of the industry here.

The well deserved aid packages for our Domestic Big Three will most definitely need to include buyer assistance - yet another can of worms.

[Michael_S]

I think light diesels will continue to have problems making sales headway until diesel is closer in price to gas.

It does me no good to get an extra 10 mpg with a diesel vehicle if I pay 30% more for the fuel to run it.

[AMERICA 123]

Originally Posted by Michael_S

I think light diesels will continue to have problems making sales headway until diesel is closer in price to gas.

It does me no good to get an extra 10 mpg with a diesel vehicle if I pay 30% more for the fuel to run it.

Sure, that would help - maybe make a frenzy for whats going to be available.

However,...... the US average premium for diesel was recently 364.9/405.9 = 11.236% .

http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/gdu/gasdiesel.asp

USA AVERAGE.

Gasoline (Cents per Gallon)......................Diesel Fuel (Cents per Gallon)
09/08/08......Change from.........................09/08/08.........Change from
....Price.....Week Ago....Year Ago.................Price........Week Ago....Year Ago
..364.8.....down -3.2....up 83.....................405.9......down -6.2....up 113.5

************************

Also, assuming a 30% differential suggests that your breakeven comparison point would be between a 23.33mpg gasser vs a 33.33 mpg diesel. Anything with a 10 mpg differential below that favors diesel - and anything above would favor the gasser - at that 30% diesel fuel premium - over regular (86 - 88 - 88.5).

Somewhat arbitrarily, my comparison point is between 'premium/high octane' and diesel which currently is running 15/23 cents a gallon higher .

So basically a 4 -6 % differential. ( 3.97-4.05 vs 4.20$ )