Insideline: Cadillac CTS-V Challenge: BMW Kinda Won

[JBsZ06]

common sense probably lead older drivers to be careful on a wet track..

M3's a great car but the v series is faster.

next m5 probably will be just as quick...

Can't wait to see it although I'm sure it will be costly..

[mbukukanyau]

Originally Posted by HoeyHimself

For everyone who has ever doubted that BMW produces the greatest drivers cars, this is point and case. While on paper it may not always seem like it, the BMW 3-series/M3 are undeniably the perfect balance of performance, comfort, practicality, and sacrifices little. I would challenge someone to find a better drivers car than the M3. It has proven competitive against cars outside it's class, exceeding in price, and by the numbers, seemingly outmatched. Cadillac has a great thing going with the CTS and the CTS-V, but it is keeping company with two different classes that both have stellar contenders. While a bargain next to the M5, it has the M3 at its heels. While some would say that was smart on GM's part, they are not building a range of competitors to the Europeans. Sure, they are coming out with a car to take on the 3-series/A4/S4/G37, which will be good, I am not sold. Maybe if they focused from the base model up instead of hoping all will be forgiven by offering one expensive variant, they could turn around perception.

No one is saying BMW's suck. They are great cars. All we are saying is, for now, the Cadillac is better than both M3 and M5. Perhaps until the next M5, which will probably be benchmarked aganist CTS V.

Definately, the CTS V is a better daily driver based on all reviews I have read due to its Magnaride set up...

Originally Posted by baloo

Johnny O'Connell?

you lost me.

[vcs2600]

Well, this episode proves that angry internet dweebs will argue about anything. Glad everyone involved had a fun time.

Originally Posted by johnstarnes

I wonder how many buyers of these cars explore all that power and ability with any regularity?

The two M3 owners I know take them to the track now and then, so I don't think it's completely uncommon. Otherwise you're pretty much wasting the car.

[V8GMT360 Guy]

Thing is, it's the driver that won.... not the car. Even Cooper said he would've been likely able to shave 3 seconds off his lap time in the V due to better brakes and more power.

[ZvetteGuy]

Originally Posted by mbukukanyau

My post on Inside line below

Ha ha! I love that post that you left... so true concerning MSNBC...

And the dude that said that the Insideline ROCKS because they are compared to them... well.... no comment You just keep reading the Insideline bud... keep on reading

[mbukukanyau]

BMW snobs were always going to cry foul. It took only 2 model Cycles to dethrone BMW. Thats American Engineering. Forget V10. The CTS V brought its race bred V8, and smaked them out of town.

Originally Posted by ZvetteGuy

Ha ha! I love that post that you left... so true concerning MSNBC...

And the dude that said that the Insideline ROCKS because they are compared to them... well.... no comment You just keep reading the Insideline bud... keep on reading

[smith7629]

Awww, did the widdle boys ego get hurt that grand-daddy's caddy wooped your elitist eurotrash?

[Al63240]

I'm gonna throw in my two cents here...

Like others have said, this contest did nothing more than bring together a group of great cars for some fun at the track. I would love to have any one of those cars (sure beats the hell out of my 98 honda civic). But if a winner must be declared, I can't for the life of me understand how an argument can be made for the M3. Heinracy (sp?) has had some track experience and Cooper has had some track experience. Granted, probably not as much, but it doesn't matter. The CTS-V posted a lap time that was ~3 seconds faster. How can the M3 be declared a winner if it was 3 seconds slower? Did I miss that day in Math class? I love the M3, but it got beat...no if, ands, or buts about it.

[Dr. Show-Me]

If the M3 is a great performance car, and nearly everybody agrees with that, but it is slower than the CTS-V, isn't the CTS-V a great car as well, (or better?)
The Hate-America-Firsters cannot accept that GM produced a great car, one even better in many ways that their Horndog German sedans. It's time for them to say that the CTS-V is a great car, produced by GM, using an up-powered LS V8, an ohv V8 at that.
On a wet track, I'll take a 21 year old driver anyday over an older more experienced driver. Until you fully understand that people can become severely injured and die in auto wrecks, you may drive like there is no tomorrow, with a belief that you are invincible and will never die.
That is why the militaries want 20 year-olds, not 40 year olds. It still hasn't dawned on the 20 year old that he may DIE.

[CorsaTurboC]

Easy math. Man + machine = race. OK, test.

Best driver = ___
Best auto = ____

Overall winner: motorsport!

Please pass in your answers at the end of the race. Thanks for your participation.

[XCR440SP]

This test shows something most that have been on the track already know. For most of you posting in this forum, you'd turn better lap times driving the M3 than you would in the CTS-V. The high power (torque) of the CTS-V requires more driving ability to control. The lower torque (and likely more linear curve, but thats just a guess by me) make the M3 much EASIER to drive fast. Thats why the BMW won in the non ringer class. Its also why the CTS-V won by a large margin in the "pro" class. The CTS-V has much more potential to perform, but requires much more driving ability.

Look at the recent Super Snake vs other tuner cars comparison for a great example. The Super Snake couldnt' beat a stock GT-500 on the course because it was too powerfull for the driver to use, great example of what I'm talking about.

[XenoRad]

Originally Posted by mbukukanyau

No one is saying BMW's suck. They are great cars. All we are saying is, for now, the Cadillac is better than both M3 and M5. Perhaps until the next M5, which will probably be benchmarked aganist CTS V.

The race didn't prove which car was better, not at all. For that to happen you'd need to have a professional driver do a hot lap in both and then have the scores compared. And even then you won't be able to say for sure.

What happened here was nothing more than a "casual" race between non-pro drivers and as such the results don't say anything about which car is better, but only about which driver was faster.

[smith7629]

Originally Posted by XCR440SP

This test shows something most that have been on the track already know. For most of you posting in this forum, you'd turn better lap times driving the M3 than you would in the CTS-V. The high power (torque) of the CTS-V requires more driving ability to control. The lower torque (and likely more linear curve, but thats just a guess by me) make the M3 much EASIER to drive fast. Thats why the BMW won in the non ringer class. Its also why the CTS-V won by a large margin in the "pro" class. The CTS-V has much more potential to perform, but requires much more driving ability.

Look at the recent Super Snake vs other tuner cars comparison for a great example. The Super Snake couldnt' beat a stock GT-500 on the course because it was too powerfull for the driver to use, great example of what I'm talking about.

People will rationalize anything. What next? A corrolla is better on the track than a ZR1 because my grandma can't handle the ZR1's torque and manual gearbox.

[tgagneguam]

Pretty predictable discourse on the part of BMW aficionados. Their perspective could be best characterized as "sour grapes," "professional GM drivers" notwithstanding.

[GMFAN85]

Originally Posted by mbukukanyau

My post on Inside line below
Quote:
I cannot believe Insideline, which did not even bother to take on Lutz offer, could stoop as low as to outright tell a tall tale as to who won. . IL credibility is wearing thin, really. First it was the attempt to push a theory that the “corvette is no longer cool”, and now this while GT-R is the best thing since sliced bread.
InsideLine is becoming the MSNBC of automotive world, loosing all credibility.

I agree with the first part of your post. However, I would've said that Inside Line is the Fox News of the automotive world. All commentary.. no news.