First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock - Page 12

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Thread: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by mgescuro View Post
    The image is what Cadillac deems it to be.
    That's why I've always said it is absolutely critical for Cadillac to market ELR as a high end toy for image seekers.

    It's obvious to US that it's underpowered, underperforming, FWD, small, uses Chevy technology, whatever.
    But to the overall public, no one is going to give a damn, if Cadillac markets is properly.

    ELR is a high profile, high cost, limited edition luxury product. They're not supposed to make a ton of them. They're not supposed to sell a ton of them either.


    If the commercials for ELR state stupid stuff like "same technology that is in Volt" and "powered by a gas generator" and "range of X miles," then Cadillac has completely missed the boat, and ELR will flop miserably.
    If the commercials for ELR state stuff like "a new breed of electric luxury" and "more technology and luxury than any car in Cadillac's long history" and "high style for green-minded urban socialites," then ELR will do nicely in a niche market.
    I agree the marketing of the ELR is key to its future. What we have so far it's what's on Cadillac's web page (emphasis mine below):

    "ELR is the provocative embodiment of imagination and inspiration. An uncompromising luxury coupe for those who ask, “What’s next?” For those who recognize the possibility of “what if” and dismiss the thought of what can’t be done. It’s for those who seek opportunities to move the world forward. And who believe that only by working hard are we able to experience the best life has to offer.
    Introducing the all new 2014 ELR. With its forward-thinking technology and forward-leaning design, ELR is an original thought in a sea of conformity and our most advanced luxury coupe ever."


    It also describes how it's the Converj concept car brought to life, which I think is another positive angle.

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  3. #167
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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by mgescuro View Post
    The image is what Cadillac deems it to be.
    What's that line about putting lipstick on a pig?

    Not meant as a shot at the ELR's looks, but otherwise it applies.
    Drives a 2011 CTS Coupe (crystal red tincoat) and a 2014 Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk (mango tango pearlcoat).

    Used to drive the 2010 Camaro pictured, until a deer hopped in front of me on I-79. Before that, I had a CTS sedan, two Firebird Formulas, a convertible Trans Am, a Reatta, a couple of Monte Carlos, an Avenger coupe, a couple of Cavalier hatchbacks, and a Saturn coupe.

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by Z28x View Post
    Every other Cadillac over $65k has a powerful engine, XTS-V, CTS-V, CTS Vsport, Escalade. Imagine if Cadillac used the 4.3L V6 in the Escalade or a 2.5L I4 in the CTS Vsport.
    Yeah but non of those cars are riding 35 miles without the use of fossil fuels either. None of those cars, with exception to the Escalade, because I haven't seen the interior up close, has an interior that comes close to this one either. Maybe 85%, but not 100.


    Having a powerful engine doesn't make a car a luxury car, but it is something all expensive luxury cars have.

    Not correct. I really wish people would research before they speak. Although not exactly apples to apples because of size differences, it still contradicts what you said.

    Mercedes S400 $93,255 (almost $20K more than ELR). 0-60 time of 7.7 seconds PROOF LINK

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by mgescuro View Post
    The image is what Cadillac deems it to be.
    That's why I've always said it is absolutely critical for Cadillac to market ELR as a high end toy for image seekers.

    It's obvious to US that it's underpowered, underperforming, FWD, small, uses Chevy technology, whatever.
    But to the overall public, no one is going to give a damn, if Cadillac markets is properly.

    ELR is a high profile, high cost, limited edition luxury product. They're not supposed to make a ton of them. They're not supposed to sell a ton of them either.


    If the commercials for ELR state stupid stuff like "same technology that is in Volt" and "powered by a gas generator" and "range of X miles," then Cadillac has completely missed the boat, and ELR will flop miserably.
    If the commercials for ELR state stuff like "a new breed of electric luxury" and "more technology and luxury than any car in Cadillac's long history" and "high style for green-minded urban socialites," then ELR will do nicely in a niche market.
    You may underestimate the consumer you are referring to here. It isn't enough to say that it's a "new breed of electric luxury" as they will immediately begin to compare it to Tesla or some such car. If you say "more technology and luxury than any car in Cadillac's long history", you will then rekindle the image of Cadillac over the last 30 years--and you do not want to go there.

    This is why the ELR in the end has too significant a possibility of hurting their image to their potential customers and should not have happened.
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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by GMOwner View Post
    You may underestimate the consumer you are referring to here. It isn't enough to say that it's a "new breed of electric luxury" as they will immediately begin to compare it to Tesla or some such car. If you say "more technology and luxury than any car in Cadillac's long history", you will then rekindle the image of Cadillac over the last 30 years--and you do not want to go there.

    This is why the ELR in the end has too significant a possibility of hurting their image to their potential customers and should not have happened.
    Another misconception. Where the Tesla has a higher EV range and quicker 0-60 time, the ELR has no range anxiety and much much more luxury

    PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE. If any of you have not actually compared these vehicles luxurious features first hand, please do so before you ever post an opinion again about the two in that regard. The Tesla S is not a Luxury car anymore anymore than my Impala LTZ is pertaining to anything outside of price. I would go so far as to say that my Chevy has a better interior than the Tesla S. Minimalist is not always the epitome of cool. In some situations the interior is down right 1980s tacky. The ELR on the other hand, I kid you not, could easily be mistaken for the best interior in any luxury vehicle below the $200,000 price tag
    Last edited by LovelyMoon; 12-19-2013 at 03:37 PM.

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    R2-D2 Astromech Droid mgescuro's Avatar
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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by ksr View Post
    What's that line about putting lipstick on a pig?
    Not meant as a shot at the ELR's looks, but otherwise it applies.
    Oh I don't think ELR is "lipstick on a pig."
    The last STS and it's half-assed MCE was "lipstick on a pig."

    ELR, at the very least, got the whole Mary kay cosmetics kit treatment.

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by mgescuro View Post
    Oh I don't think ELR is "lipstick on a pig."
    The last STS and it's half-assed MCE was "lipstick on a pig."

    ELR, at the very least, got the whole Mary kay cosmetics kit treatment.
    No doubt. I'd say they went all "Dr. Roberto Rey 90210 " on that ass for sure.

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by GMOwner View Post
    ...and the ELR has an image problem. Image is derived by perception despite the manufacturers attempt at otherwise.

    In this case, people perceive the ELR as a hopped up Volt because it is based on the same "technology". This is where GM failed on this technology. This is 10 years too late starting on the wrong brand (Chevy).

    This is why ELR's image is basically associated with people's perception that GM follows the market--not lead it.
    OK, it will sell a few of them and GM knows it, but, in the end, the ELR is just not the right move for GM.

    Sorry to keep this thread going...
    I don't agree with any of the characterizations that you have presented.

    I like the ELR partially because it is based on Voltec drive train. Everything else, brand, performance, exterior and interior styling etc all hit the right check boxes with me. The only thing that stops me is the price but I can't afford $30,000+ watch or to own a vacation home in the Caribbean that I visit once every other year either

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by Voltastic View Post
    The only thing that stops me is the price but I can't afford $30,000+ watch or to own a vacation home in the Caribbean that I visit once every other year either
    I believe that's Cadillac's point.

    No longer will they sell "value oriented" luxury cars. They will sell cars that compete with the world's best and are in the true luxury class.
    Cadillac was never meant to be cheap. It's was GM's own borked decision that forced Cadillac down-market.


    I mean, I'm waiting for the big bitch-fest for when Cadillac launches the Omega and it has a base price in the $70,000's.

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by mgescuro View Post
    I mean, I'm waiting for the big bitch-fest for when Cadillac launches the Omega and it has a base price in the $70,000's.

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Is it inconceivable that Cadillac only expects around 250 sales a month and that asking a premium price,
    allows Cadillac to maximize profit on minimum production and resources?

    What's the point of setting ELR's price at say, $50,000 if it merely doubled sales, the additional resources
    used to create twice as many products but the lower price could mean that strategy barely equaling the
    nett profit achieved from premium pricing and lower sales.

    From what I can find, attractive leasing is of far more value to luxury buyers than quibbling over cash price...
    Last edited by jpd80; 12-20-2013 at 03:47 AM.

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by jpd80 View Post
    Is it inconceivable that Cadillac only expects around 250 sales a month and that asking a premium price,
    allows Cadillac to maximize profit on minimum production and resources?

    What's the point of setting ELR's price at say, $50,000 if it merely doubled sales, the additional resources
    used to create twice as many products but the lower price could mean that strategy barely equaling the
    nett profit achieved from premium pricing and lower sales.

    From what I can find, attractive leasing is of far more value to luxury buyers than quibbling over cash price...
    Great points. The issue at hand is that many people commenting on this subject are not able to conceive paying $50,000 for a car let alone $75,000. The leasing idea is great as well, but this forum is not the sample group one uses to figure out if Leasing will be successful either. Certainly there are some forum members here who could qualify for a lease on a $75,000 Cadillac, but how many?

    What Mgescuro points out about Voltastic's post is correct as well. Cadillac can no longer be the value luxury brand its the epitome of oxymoron if ever I have heard one. Cadillac has realigned it's vehicles so that the right cars, in the right segment, are going to the right people in accordance with who can actually afford the car, but the payments. Pricing can be high because lease opportunities are more reasonable


    Disclaimer about demographics in income: Of course this will vary immensely as credit financing and circumstances change. For instance. You will have ATS/3series buyers who are still living with mom and dad, thus allowing them to afford the price tag easier. Read JD Powers Death of Demographics to see why there are discrepancies, thus I can't use income demographics



    Anyway. Leasing makes this stuff easy. You can lease a $58,000 BMW 535 for $499 per month. This puts people in cars, but doesn't hurt the vehicles perception because they didn't have to cheapen the MSRP to get you in it. Cadillac, now, with GM Financial can do the same. It also has unbelievable relationships with Credit Unions and Banks because of all the business it sent them after the BK when they did not have a their own captive financing.

    BTW. Tesla is shifty as hell in their leasing: 63 monthly payments of $1097, excluding taxes and registration fees, for the 60-kWh model.
    63 monthly payments of $1252, excluding taxes and registration fees, for the 85-kWh model. Then they say it will REALLY only cost you $500 a month when you calculate the savings from zero gas, tax credits, and no oil changes etc.

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Can't wait to see them piling up on lots......!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HOW friggin stupid are these guys???????????

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by samy1691 View Post
    Can't wait to see them piling up on lots......!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HOW friggin stupid are these guys???????????



    When ever I see posts like this from members who have that many post in 10 years, it always makes me laugh

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    Re: First drive: 2015 Cadillac ELR gives us sticker shock

    Quote Originally Posted by samy1691 View Post
    Can't wait to see them piling up on lots......!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HOW friggin stupid are these guys???????????
    Considering they're only looking to sell 250 a month, it's gonna be a pretty small pile.
    Cadillac dealer here never had more than one XLR at a time.

    Out here in Corn Country I'll bet I see an ELR before I see a Tesla.
    I got tired of waiting for GM to make a FWD convertible.

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