Cadillac SRX as good as Q5?

[AndrewGS]

Originally Posted by 1G6

If you're asking the Cadillac dealers to build standalone stores, you damn well better give them something to sell.

You might want to make it desirable so the customers come to buy it and profitable to keep the doors open.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by goblue

Wes and Mgescuro, I'm with you on cars, and frankly - if it were 5 or 10 years ago, I'd demand all RWD crossovers as well. However, things have changed. Haldex is incredible. There is a market for RWD cars, but for whatever reason, its just not there for crossovers. It would be foolish for GM in its present state to go after that market.

It certainly isn't stopping BMW from going FWD is it?
You're arguing a point that NOT ONE SINGLE AUTOMAKER IS FOLLOWING. Name one automaker that shifted from RWD/FWD to FWD/AWD and started arguing the benefits of Haldex? NOT ONE.
Infiniti comes closest because they too had a crappy selling sport CUV. But they kept with the Skyline platform, improved the interior quality, and kept going with it. They didn't go to the Altima platform, stuff Haldex into it and started preaching it's friggin benefits!!!!!!!!!!

The reason for GM's bankruptcy can be directly attributed to completely inane business decisions like the one being discussed in this thread.

Originally Posted by goblue

Where Cadillac is really missing opportunity is by not moving the whole lineup over to VOLTEC ASAP. It's the engineering interpretation of A&S.

Oh please. GM couldn't even disseminate 2Mode throughout it's lineup, and it's exponentially CHEAPER than Voltec!!

As I've said before, Voltec is not the key to success in the luxury market!!! The basic tenets of a luxury sedan/coupe will ALWAYS remain in play: leather, amenities, technology. Right now, Cadillac CANNOT even get those right.

[1G6]

Originally Posted by AndrewGS

You might want to make it desirable so the customers come to buy it and profitable to keep the doors open.

Two points:

This SRX is eminently desirable to its target audience.

Take ES and RS away from Lexus and see how long those dealerships remain busy.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by 1G6

This SRX is eminently desirable to its target audience.

Ooo?? Please identify said target audience.

[1G6]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Ooo?? Please identify said target audience.

Everyone who bought a competing CUV despite the previous model's lauded dynamics.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by 1G6

Everyone who bought a competing CUV despite the previous model's lauded dynamics.

So, SRX v2, is now "eminently desirable" to those who bought X5, Cayenne, MDX, Q5, Q7, LR3, RX, MKX, over the SRX v1.

If that's a target, then you're using a shotgun.

[1G6]

You just watch.

[AndrewGS]

Originally Posted by 1G6

You just watch.

The new SRX will sell on style and price. It will definitely sell better than the Sigma SRX, but it won't be on luxury amenities and refinement.

[schmallz]

Originally Posted by goblue

Where Cadillac is really missing opportunity is by not moving the whole lineup over to VOLTEC ASAP. It's the engineering interpretation of A&S.

But what about the V Series Variants? It will be tough to make a beast like the CTS-V on epsilon II.

But if Buicks are designed from he ground up to be Hybrids and Voltecs, Cadillacs can be designed from the ground up to have enormous amounts of horsepower.

And you have pretty much most of the Luxury market covered by two very different brands that won't compete with each other.

[goblue]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

It certainly isn't stopping BMW from going FWD is it?
You're arguing a point that NOT ONE SINGLE AUTOMAKER IS FOLLOWING. Name one automaker that shifted from RWD/FWD to FWD/AWD and started arguing the benefits of Haldex? NOT ONE.
Infiniti comes closest because they too had a crappy selling sport CUV. But they kept with the Skyline platform, improved the interior quality, and kept going with it. They didn't go to the Altima platform, stuff Haldex into it and started preaching it's friggin benefits!!!!!!!!!!

The reason for GM's bankruptcy can be directly attributed to completely inane business decisions like the one being discussed in this thread.


Oh please. GM couldn't even disseminate 2Mode throughout it's lineup, and it's exponentially CHEAPER than Voltec!!

As I've said before, Voltec is not the key to success in the luxury market!!! The basic tenets of a luxury sedan/coupe will ALWAYS remain in play: leather, amenities, technology. Right now, Cadillac CANNOT even get those right.

BS.

It's like you seem to think that driving dynamics is free, but refinement costs money?

The SRX is slightly less refined in terms of leather quality and screw covers because they put the money into brakes, suspension components, etc.

The SRX is competitive and is in a good place on the ride / handling and refinement continuum.

[AMERICA 123]

Originally Posted by 1G6

Everyone who bought a competing CUV despite the previous model's lauded dynamics.

Originally Posted by 1G6

You just watch.

Exactly - on both.

The new SRX is going to be somewhere between "very" - and "extremely" good as far as acceptance and sales - that why all the 'special' negativity that might of had some relevance 5 - 20 years ago.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by goblue

The SRX is slightly less refined in terms of leather quality and screw covers because they put the money into brakes, suspension components, etc.

Do you even realize what you just said!!!!

It's ok that Cadillac skimped out a little on the interior to make sure it drove right.
You're trying validate GM's practice of cutting corners.

It's a luxury car and shouldn't suffer these deficiencies... At All...

[plane]

It's not even out.
I haven't seen a single SRX on the road.
And we're already screaming doom and gloom?
Sounds like some premature speculation on someone's part.

[goblue]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Do you even realize what you just said!!!!

It's ok that Cadillac skimped out a little on the interior to make sure it drove right.
You're trying validate GM's practice of cutting corners.

It's a luxury car and shouldn't suffer these deficiencies... At All...

Yeah, I know exactly what I said.

I'd prefer a slightly less luxurious interior for better drivability. Luxury is a spectrum. Entry level Cadillacs do not need Maybach level interiors at the expense of drivability.

Why don't you point out that Lexus cut corners on drivability. A numb experience costs less than a perfect ride / handling balance.

I really think you fail to recognize that all of this is on a number of spectrums, and when you add them all up, they tend to equal price.
I can respect the idea that Cadillac should pull a "10" on everything, but then you'd have a 80 grand SRX. That won't help GM right now.

And I stick with VOLTEC. The 2 mode is not a long term solution and it makes no sense for anything other than trucks. Parallel hybrids don't make any sense in general anyway. Why a whole VOLTEC lineup makes sense is it elevates the whole brand and makes it known as the new standard. It also solves the platform issues.

[mgescuro]

Originally Posted by goblue

Yeah, I know exactly what I said.

I'd prefer a slightly less luxurious interior for better drivability. Luxury is a spectrum. Entry level Cadillacs do not need Maybach level interiors at the expense of drivability.

Why don't you point out that Lexus cut corners on drivability. A numb experience costs less than a perfect ride / handling balance.

But when you read reviews state that Cadillac's interior is great, but XXX competition does it better, doesn't that just make you wonder why Cadillac couldn't execute better?

I don't expect Maybach level interiors -- and if you're ever been in a Maybach, it can actually be much better for that price, but there are 100s of ways to option one out -- but I expect something that belies the heritage of a brand that used to lead the segment.

Why don't I criticized Lexus for its drivability? Because it's not a cut corner. It's a feature. Lexus is about the isolated ride. It always has been. And after 20 years, its customers want the isolation. It isn't supposed to be a sport sedan/cuv/coupe. It is a luxury sedan/cuv/coupe. And that's the problem with the F-series. Lexus is trying to be something it just wasn't designed to be -- a sports car.

Originally Posted by goblue

I really think you fail to recognize that all of this is on a number of spectrums, and when you add them all up, they tend to equal price.
I can respect the idea that Cadillac should pull a "10" on everything, but then you'd have a 80 grand SRX. That won't help GM right now.

And I think you're slotting Cadillac in a "spectrum" it shouldn't be in.
I think yo'ure exaggerating. I"m asking for better than GM standard plastics and full leather seats. The difference would take a base msrp from $34k to $36k.
Cadillac shouldn't be value pricing anything.

Originally Posted by goblue

And I stick with VOLTEC. The 2 mode is not a long term solution and it makes no sense for anything other than trucks. Parallel hybrids don't make any sense in general anyway. Why a whole VOLTEC lineup makes sense is it elevates the whole brand and makes it known as the new standard. It also solves the platform issues.

Toyota HSD is now Plugin. It's also the market leader and leads in recognition.
VOltec will still take some time to ramp up.
2Mode Plugin should be more than enough to provide an advanced hybrid for any future cadillacs -- or even SRX.