Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

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Thread: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

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    Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Okay, been to my two favorite bodyshop guys and both were dumbfounded (sort-of). On my 2000 Camaro, on the C pillar and up over the roof and back down on the other side, about 1/2 inch in from the window and T-tops on the leading edge, and again about a 1/2 inch in from the back window on the back edge, the paint and/or the fiberglass is starting to ripple.

    No cracking of the paint so far. This started last summer just on the top front of the roof portion, and has now carried down the sides and has done the same on the back edge. It's happening no where else on the pillar or roof, or anywhere else on the car. Just in these two straight lines from side to side.

    I have my idea of what the problem is, and one of the two body guys gave me the same answer but said he had never seen anything like it before. The other one was just clueless (this one at the dealer). So, if a dealer's shop hasn't seen this, I am hoping someone else has. Open for thoughts. I would post pictures, but you can't see it. Help!
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Try to post a picture if you can...I'm trrying to visualize it & I can't!

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    It just doesn't show in pictures. The paint is smooth to the touch, but visually looks like it is rippled or bubbling, except in the photos. Here is something to help visualize. Think chrome bumper Vettes, C3s from late 60's. On the nose, just in front of the hood, they often get ripples from the rivets underneath. I think the early C4s had similar issues. That is what it looks like. However, there are no rivets. If you can't visualize, I will toss out my opinion and you can give it a probability rating.
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Maybe because it is black and it gets some water there, the water superheats the paint? I have no idea, but is that a possibility??

    Do you leave the car outside or in a garage?

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    It almost sounds like a panel seperation...but it's not visible on a camera?


    New one on me too....and I was an interim body shop manager for a while!

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Sounds like body flex to me.. I've seen a few 80s Mustangs with similar ripples around the tops of the B-pillars. On most cars, the roof ties the A, B, and C pillars together to reinforce the body. Since your car has T-tops, the side-to-side twisting force is focused on the C-pillars rather than being spread evenly across the roof.

    If that's the case, you will need to install subframe/chassis braces to help stiffen the body before having the ripples fixed. Otherwise they'll just come back in a few years.

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Car is garaged. Has not been driven between November and April. Barely sees rain. Only water is on bath days. 37,560 miles. Original owner.

    Here is my thought. You both hit on points that play into the theory I mentioned.

    Could the adhesive used to hold the fiberglass to the quarter panel and the roof support through heating and cooling started to break down the fiberglass underneath, giving the rippled appearance but not causing noticeable effects on the surface?

    With this though, I would expect other cars to see similar issues.
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Quote Originally Posted by rearden82
    Sounds like body flex to me.. I've seen a few 80s Mustangs with similar ripples around the tops of the B-pillars. On most cars, the roof ties the A, B, and C pillars together to reinforce the body. Since your car has T-tops, the side-to-side twisting force is focused on the C-pillars rather than being spread evenly across the roof.

    If that's the case, you will need to install subframe/chassis braces to help stiffen the body before having the ripples fixed. Otherwise they'll just come back in a few years.
    I thought about that, too. However, the only ripples I have from body flex is right on the top of both quarters at the base of the C pillars. After this occurred in 2003, I installed subframes. These just started last year. And they truly are perfectly symetrical on both sides all the way across the top. Maybe it still is body flex. I really have no idea. But, neither did the people I have showed it to.
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Okay, though you cannot see the rippling effects (yes, these are night photos, but you can't see it in the daytime photos either) here is a picture that illustrates where these lines are at on the car. Maybe this will spark some ideas.

    http://www.geocities.com/c21stewart/...?1181619049346
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    I can tell slightly what you mean...IMHO it's due to flexing I think...

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Quote Originally Posted by GMCSonoma
    I can tell slightly what you mean...IMHO it's due to flexing I think...
    I can buy that. Going with the idea of flex, what am I looking at to correct the issue? Is it as simple as a repaint, or are we talking fiberglass replacement? No matter which one, I have already told myself 15 years before I start major overhauls. Besides, I can't be dipping into my 2009 Hugger Orange Pearl Tri-Coat Camaro Convertible Indy 500 Pace Car funding!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    I have the same ripple effect on my Firebird. If you are standing by the drivers door, there is a ripple effect in the paint about 1/2" behind the rubber seal on the T-Tops running the length of the top of the car. Very strange.
    "The only people who put iced tea in Jack Daniel's bottles is The Clash babayyyyy!!!" David Lee Roth

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    I misread your original post.. I thought the ripples were near where the C-pillars joined to the roof; that's why I was thinking it was body flex.

    My Mark VIII has a fiberglass hood glued to an underlying frame. From certain angles I can see dimples in the paint at what appear to be the bonding points (they look kinda like spot welds). Based on that, if your roof panel is attached with 2 continuous strips of adhesive, it'd explain what you're seeing.

    Your best bet would probably be to have it checked out at a shop that specializes in sports cars, or even boats. They'd probably have more experience with bonded fiberglass panels than a typical body shop.

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    DING, DING, DING! We have a winner....

    There is a technical bulletin stating that the F-Body may show signs of bubbling (i.e. ripples) on the roof of the car. No explanation was really given, however, in the illustration it shows that the adhesive is applied in the general area (i.e. right underneath) of the bubbles. The bulletin calls for full roof replacement under warranty. Unfortunately, I left the copy that the body shop manager gave me at work. I think that the number was 03-08-98-103 or something along those lines. Will post it tomorrow for sure.

    Anyways, the crap of it is this: My car is 7 years and 6 days exactly old. After much debate, the service manager decided it was not an option for them to cover the replacement. That being the fact it was 5 years older than the warranty period, and 2,600 miles over the warranty mileage. However, I could have it done for just $1,290.00. Thanks anyways. I'll take them up on that in 7 years 350 days.

    Thanks for the input guys and gals. I guess this now turns into a thread on "How to get the Service Manager to say yes to a warranty item after the warranty expires". If you have advice for this, please let me know!
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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    Re: Oddest Thing: Paint/glass on Camaro C pillar

    Okay, I have a pic that barely shows the effects along the bottom of the C pillar. See the circled area.

    http://www.geocities.com/c21stewart/roof_2.html
    Last edited by Hood Scoop; 06-12-2007 at 09:09 PM.
    Craig

    In my garage:
    2000 Chevrolet Camaro SS (SLP)
    2012 GMC Terrain SLT2

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