Wards claims "Clean Diesel Languishing on Consumer Radar, Survey Shows"

[377Z]

American consumers are, by a wide margin, more interested in hybrid-electric powertrains than clean diesel engines, according to a J.D. Power and Associates survey on emerging technologies.
Of 20 safety, comfort, infotainment and powertrain technologies reviewed in the annual study released today, clean diesel engines finished dead last in terms of consumer interest. Just 6% of respondents were “definitely interested,” despite the fuel savings and performance benefits delivered by the technology.

So, its not on the radar, but somehow diesels slightly edge out hybrids in actual installation rates:

Ward’s engine installation data belies the disparity between hybrids and diesels. For model-year ’07, hybrids accounted for 2.3% of U.S. light-vehicle powertrains, compared with 2.4% penetration for diesels.

Article goes on to point out that this is the first year hybrids even appeared in the top 20. Considering the hype hybrids have been getting for several years now, compared with basically no advertising & sporadic availability of a few models of diesels in the US for , I'd say its a pretty good showing for diesels.

Rest of article: http://wardsauto.com/ar/clean_diesel_languishing/

[AMERICA 123]

Boy, you sure got that right.

All of your above plus......

Hybrid 'Hype' plus some negative spin for diesel, diesel fuel prices, hybrid incentives, a pessimistic Epa procedure for diesel along with an incomplete and therefore optimistically misleading one for HSD hybrids....... the list just goes on and on.

And yet, there are the numbers.

It's a shame really, on a level playing field , diesel would be ahead - diesel can work for everybody - all the time - almost.

American derived Bio diesel augmentation and later more diesel stuff, including some fuel chemistry 'tweaks' that that bio sourcing makes more attractive to do - is an unbeatable combination for all the national goals - concerning fuel.

[Bggriffi]

Maybe, if we had more diesel cars and SUVs, people would be interested. I can't wait for the new diesels from VW and Honda (GM?) to start winning fuel economy tests against the Prius and Camry hybrid.

[377Z]

Exactly. Currently passenger car diesels have next to zero exposure in NA. Some objective real world compros should turn that around pretty quick IMO, or at least that's my hope--perhaps then we could actually get the media on the bandwagon.

[ph39]

In most of Europe - Diesel costs less than gasoline. In the US - diesel costs more. As long as it stays that way - gas hybrids will be more popular in the US and diesels will be more popular in Europe.

[goblue]

Originally Posted by ph39

In most of Europe - Diesel costs less than gasoline. In the US - diesel costs more. As long as it stays that way - gas hybrids will be more popular in the US and diesels will be more popular in Europe.

Yeah, but a diesel Jetta is a nicer, faster and more fuel efficient car compared to a Prius. So - the extra $0.60 a gallon isn't a big deal.

[ph39]

Originally Posted by goblue

Yeah, but a diesel Jetta is a nicer, faster and more fuel efficient car compared to a Prius. So - the extra $0.60 a gallon isn't a big deal.

Your right - but the question is - is a turbo gas Jetta hybid as efficient as a diesel - and you dont have to pay the extra $0.60 / gallon.

By the way - I'm not a big hybrid supporter - just stating they way I think most people in the US will feel.

[377Z]

Originally Posted by ph39

In most of Europe - Diesel costs less than gasoline. In the US - diesel costs more. As long as it stays that way - gas hybrids will be more popular in the US and diesels will be more popular in Europe.

...except that based on take rates diesels currently have the slight edge, despite the negative perceptions and near zero exposure to the NA market.

[Whitesky]

Originally Posted by Bggriffi

Maybe, if we had more diesel cars and SUVs, people would be interested. I can't wait for the new diesels from VW and Honda (GM?) to start winning fuel economy tests against the Prius and Camry hybrid.

Or, what if someone actually made a decent looking hybrid? There isn't a single diesel or hybrid I would consider just because of the way they all look.

[Smaart Aas Saabr]

Originally Posted by Whitesky

Or, what if someone actually made a decent looking hybrid? There isn't a single diesel or hybrid I would consider just because of the way they all look.

How do they look? Most of those 2,4 % diesel vehicles are heavy-duty Big Three pickup trucks where the diesel accounts for like 50 - 80 % of sales.

[PA Dweller]

Diesels are great and I considered buying one, but again I refuse to pay an extra dollar per gallon for fuel that is less refined than gasoline. It's a rip off, and I don't care for the excuses.

[PhishPhood]

Originally Posted by 377Z

Exactly. Currently passenger car diesels have next to zero exposure in NA. Some objective real world compros should turn that around pretty quick IMO, or at least that's my hope--perhaps then we could actually get the media on the bandwagon.

Heck the manufacturers aren't even on the bandwagon.

Honda brings its new high-tech clean diesel over from the UK then hides it in a closet. The TSX diesel will be a premium priced niche vehicle using very expensive fuel.

On the VW side it's only being offered as a strippie as I understand it. No upscale features are available. This to hold the price in line so that it doesn't get above the Prius when the expensive fuel is factored in. It will undoubtedly drive better but it won't save any money.

GM, Ford and Toyota are already on record as being against diesels for the NA market in light passenger vehicles. Now trucks are a different story.

[mmciau]

Originally Posted by PhishPhood

...

GM, Ford and Toyota are already on record as being against diesels for the NA market in light passenger vehicles. Now trucks are a different story.

And how many diesel trucks from GM, Ford and Toyota are now sitting in paddocks, unsold?



Mike

[Whitesky]

Originally Posted by Smaart Aas Saabr

How do they look? Most of those 2,4 % diesel vehicles are heavy-duty Big Three pickup trucks where the diesel accounts for like 50 - 80 % of sales.

I thought that VW made their goofy little cars diesels. But, according to this http://alternativefuels.about.com/od...esel-Vehicles/ it looks like I'm wrong. There is a grand total of one vehicle that I would consider (Cherokee).

[377Z]

Originally Posted by PhishPhood

Heck the manufacturers aren't even on the bandwagon.

Honda brings its new high-tech clean diesel over from the UK then hides it in a closet. The TSX diesel will be a premium priced niche vehicle using very expensive fuel.

On the VW side it's only being offered as a strippie as I understand it. No upscale features are available. This to hold the price in line so that it doesn't get above the Prius when the expensive fuel is factored in. It will undoubtedly drive better but it won't save any money.

GM, Ford and Toyota are already on record as being against diesels for the NA market in light passenger vehicles. Now trucks are a different story.

You're right, and its maddening to a diesel fan. I can't believe that a state of the art diesel passenger car powertrain is more expensive than a state of the art hybrid passenger car powertrain.

IIRC VW is the only mftr that will offer an affordable diesel passenger vechicle. I also read that they are only planning on importing some 7,000 annually (again IIRC), which means they clearly have no plans on really pushing it.

If I were in charge at VW NA, I'd come up with some real world comparison between the Jetta diesel and some competitors hybrids & have a mini 'autoshow in motion'-esque hands on exhibit in some of the major markets. It would demonstrate that diesels are no longer smelly loud contraptions for weird people, that they drive very well and get excellent real world fuel economy. I'd even have some display where you could enter in your annual mileage & directly compare all costs. It wouldn't convert everyone into a dieselhead, but I think there is a significantly larger portion of the population that would find it an attractive alternative if they were jsut turned on to the benefits. It would undoubtedly do more than those stupid 'talking bug' VW commercials.