GM hangs on to its share of market

[psece]

Originally Posted by goatgary

An all new vehicle or major make over is $1 billion plus by the time you factor in the new tooling, assembly plant modification, testing and parts manufacturing.

Man, hard to imagine that you can make any money on designing and building cars. The only thing I am unsure of is if they, in fact, saved any money by moving delivery up a year. I can't see it costing more as you have a whole year of savings to offset any move up costs.

[unkillsam]

Originally Posted by steve333

Toyota was selling as many as they could build. Is the same true for the Cobalt?
Seriously how can anyone say that GM did not screw up by pushing back the development of their small and midsize cars?
Criticizing GM for screwing up is what GM needs, not apologetics.
GM screwed up big time. The Cobalt and Aveo should have been replaced this year at the latest because their current offerings are not world class and most folks know it.

I don't think that Toyota ever imagined that Ford would ever be within striking distance of Corolla sales with the Focus and yet Ford is.

The redesigned Corolla is crap.

I was not apologizing, just sick of the masses swooning over Toyota when they clearly are trying to sell more large trucks and suvs.

And with the new Camry being owned by the Malibu and Accord, and the Focus starting to catch up with the Corolla, and the Fit and Versa being better Yaris, it is clear to me that Toyota's attentions are not on small fuel efficient cars.

Plus they screwed up Scion and they have worse fuel efficiency now too.

[ChevroletRevived]

This is the numbers that really count. Retail sales are the most important (and most profitable) type of sales. So, if retail share of the market is holding steady that's a good sign. It means that GM has ended decline in this area, Sales down? Yes, sales are down for everyone that's to be expected. GM's still getting it's piece of (albeit shrinking) pie. It'll be nice to see some gains starting to be made and I think that'll start to happen pretty soon.


BTW guys, something tells me it's wrong to start sentences with an "and" or "but"; just doesn't look right to me.

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by VCDJ

Ok here is problem with cobalt. Sedan looks like S**t. Poor resale value. Not so good quality. So all of that cobalt ss performance does not matter to people.
Aveo crapy fuel economy and questionable quality
Malibu. Great car But there is nothing class leading about it. V-6 accord has more power, its bigger and it will get 2 mpg better. Malibu is a good car. IT should of been out 3 years ago.
So what does gm have that is class leading and that is not suv or a truck?

V6 accord also looks like total crap. I've seen dealer lots with inventories of 20+ accords, but only three or four Malibus on Chevy lots.
As for class leading, what the hell is the Corvette? CTS? Lambdas?
Quite honestly, out of all the posts I've seen you make here, I've seen very few pro-GM posts. The majority of your posts are always things about how GM was stupid to do this, GM was stupid to do that. GM makes mistakes just like every other automaker. Why do you think toyota's recalling all those cars from NUMMI, why do they have to buy back all those tacomas? Why did honda recall the accord? They screwed up, plain and simple. GM has done the same thing, and I'm sure there will be more mistakes down the road. At least they've learned from those mistakes.
In response to your remarks about the Tahoe Two-Mode, I don't believe you read the article posted here written by a hybrid driver who was given a chance to drive the Tahoe and milked 30 MPG out of it. That's the fuel economy of my Malibu in a full size SUV. Hardly a waste of $50k if fuel efficiency and a large SUV is required.

[kknobl]

Awesome news for GM!

This could be the beginning of a great comeback for GM. Rick & Bob for Prez and VP!

The fact that GM HELD share when the economy basically sucks is that much more an accomplishment, in spite of what VCDJ says. BTW, can't we ban this person???? His posts are at best moronic.

[63GrandSport001]

Originally Posted by mtndrew1

The following GM cars I've never seen without a rental-agency plate frame:

Aveo
LaCrosse
Lucerne
DTS
Malibu (still)
G6
G5
Torrent
Equinox
Grand Prix
Aura
Impala

Literally, I've never seen one of any of those that weren't rentals. Ever. And I have a keen eye for this sort of thing (it's a terrible affliction). I'm sure they're out there, but it's just an absolute given than an "American" car in Los Angeles is a rental or a government vehicle.

I've suggested GM vehicles, when appropriate, to people asking me for car advice. "I don't want a to drive a rental car" is the default response, even when I suggest the stunning CTS.

In Southern California, if it's GM and not an SUV, it's just a fleet car, plain and simple. I've seen a (small) handful of private HHRs and CTSs, but nothing to really make note of. I've still seen more Enterprise CTSs than private, which is sad.

I was flipping through channels recently and came across some celeb-trash show and some celebrity was getting into a new Impala. The camera guy said "is that a rental?" and the celeb said something to the effect of "yeah I wouldn't be caught dead in this thing otherwise" and then proceeded to make fun of the car. He'd probably say that about a Camry too, but it's still somewhat indicative of the general consensus.

GM should just stop selling to rental agencies in SoCal, they'd probably get a 300% bump in retail sales within a year once people didn't feel like they'd be driving out of their local Avis after taking delivery.

At this point sales lost by older weaker vehicles will be more then off set by newer models. For Chevy their cars have hit just about rock bottom and can almost only go up at this point as their products get better.

The Aveo 5 door is new, the Malibu is new, there is a new Cobalt coming soon and with gas prices so high I expect the current Cobalt to do pretty well at the end of its life. The Impala is also a strong seller and there is also a new one of those is coming as well so I can see Chevy doing better. While the new cross over will help to offset some of those GMT-900 sales losses as gas price rise still. A new Nox too........

[chakis24]

Originally Posted by VCDJ

People will not buy cars???? What planet do you live on. Last time i Checked fastest growing market is in small cars. Car sales are going Up. Suv and truck sales have collapesed.
People will not buy cars like lacrosse, cobalt and aveo. They buy cars like Civic, accord, camry, fit, yaris corrola. That is what they buy

you know what i mean. people think cars, they think import. that takes awhile to change, that doesnt change overnight. gm would still be selling those new cars at a loss (and without help from competitive trucks, wheres the income?), and with things were (and still are) at gm, that means zero positive cash flow- putting them in a worse position than theyre in now. yeah, some people will buy them, but it takes years to overcome peoples perceptions.

[chakis24]

Originally Posted by GMC-70

A hybrid SUV makes a great image and great sense---just not at 50k. Bring it down to 40k and it starts to make alot more sense. Start using it in the smaller crossovers and it really starts making sense if they can keep it cost effective.

thats why its in the trucks first- large profits. if they put it in cars first they would have even more of a loss.

trucks make money, no matter what shape or form. the 2mode is in trucks now so they can still make money on it, or at least break even. with 2mode, now they make say 3000 per truck instead of 7000. this way production goes up, they still make money, and eventually it can trickle down.

no trucks = no money, for gm anyway- and they need all the help they can get.

[t-rex]

Originally Posted by kknobl

BTW, can't we ban this person???? His posts are at best moronic.

Then you'd have to ban 95% of GMI membership by that criteria.

I can name at best about two dozen of the GMI regulars who aren't absolute, flat-out retardapes.

The more I read here on GMI, the more I just get outright disgusted by how utterly stupid the average person is.

I don't even care enough any more to complain. And trust me, THAT's saying something...


But regarding GM's market share. Hopefully GM can overcome its bad image and its promising new products will find lots and lots of buyers. I'm a bit disappointed by initial Malibu sales. I thought it'd be selling much, much better. And the Astra seems to floundering badly. Maybe if GM advertised it.

With a killer product line, GM could scratch its way back to a 28% — dare I say even 30%? — market share. Sadly though, it'd likely come at Ford's and Chrysler's expense rather the import brands.

[1G6]

Originally Posted by t-rex

The more I read here on GMI, the more I just get outright disgusted by how utterly stupid the average person is.

You live in New Orleans, yet you're only now realizing this?

[steve333]

Originally Posted by psece

How much time and money does it take to redesign a vehicle? I don't know but let's say 4 years and 150 million dollars. At year 2 and 50 million into the redesign, you start seeing indicators that the target market is starting to shrink.

Do you:
A. Throw away 2 years and 50 million on the new platform and spend a year and another 50 million on a MCE type refresh?
B. Accelerate development of the new platform, saving some money(No year 4) and getting it out a year early. The market hasn't shrunk as much and you are still seeing a healthy return because people expect to pay more to get a 1st year vehicle.
C. Do you keep the schedule, spending the 150 million, and releasing to a market that had another year to shrink. Your returns aren't as good as a normal 1st year vehicle because gas prices have gone up even more.

I:
1. Make my product world class from the start. If its not I
2. Constantly improve the product to keep it competitive.
3. Recognize market trends and plan accordingly-in this case the trend towards small fuel efficient cars.

Let me know when GM does this. I know Mazda does, the 3 was rated best small car when it came out, yet they managed to improve it every year since it came out to keep it number one.
The Cobalt was near the head of the class when it came out-yet not quite there yet. Some tweaks would have helped, yet they ignore the cars glaring faults. As such a replacement should have been ready next year not in 2 years.

[packardlust]

Originally Posted by VCDJ

Ok here is problem with cobalt. Sedan looks like S**t. Poor resale value. Not so good quality. So all of that cobalt ss performance does not matter to people.
Aveo crapy fuel economy and questionable quality
Malibu. Great car But there is nothing class leading about it. V-6 accord has more power, its bigger and it will get 2 mpg better. Malibu is a good car. IT should of been out 3 years ago.
So what does gm have that is class leading and that is not suv or a truck?

Crappy fuel economy for Aveo? We hear that a lot on this sight. Where is the evidence? I suggest you ask an owner of one. My neighbor bought one 2 years ago. He records mileage and every gas purchase. He has consistently gotten 30 mpg in the city, and 35 mpg on road trips. That is pretty damn good in my book. For the vehicle price, it is better than good, I rented for a week a new Honda Accord in Florida 3 weeks ago. I got 27 mpg in mixed easy driving. The Aveo is a more comfortable, and in my opinion more roomy. I rented a Impala a month ago in Vegas, It is no Accord, than God. 26 mpg in mixed driving, and much more comfortable than the Accord. The new Accord may be popular, I just wonder what the buyers are comparing it to.

[espo19047]

Originally Posted by VCDJ

Yes but toyota also had New Yaris out, New camry out and camry hybrid, New Prius out. They had scion. So what did gm had that was competitiee with any of those cars. Nothing. That is the difference between toyota and gm. Toyota has more fuel efficient cars.

The Cobalt sales blow away the Scion. Thanks for taking a positive article and making it negative.

[treekiller]

Originally Posted by chakis24

the cobalt matches corolla's mpg. both get 35. the new focus also gets 35. civic gets 36. im pretty sure thats competitive, 1 mpg seperates them?

theres nothing gm can do yet about resale value- thats all perception. until the word spreads on the new stuff, that wont change. the new silverado is already projected to have the highest resale value among competitors. that wont change overnight.

Yes and the colbalt does that with the largest base engine in that group so it's nicer to drive (you don't have to RAG it to get it to move, like you do with the corolla) and as of this model year the ability to run on E85.. I don't understand why they don't lower the displacement of the ecotec to match it's rivals a nice high compression NA 2.0 could make a nice base engine, and all the parts are in the bin.

as for resale one way to assure low resale is to discount the crud out of new ones, and it's all a matter of selling new cars at full retail. which means having desirable product. simple enough.

[PA Dweller]

Well this is good news. I hope soon GM's market share will go up, most of their recent vehicles are great.

Originally Posted by CobaltSScrazy

Consumers purchase aveo, its one of the cheapest subcompacts on the road if not THE cheapest. Cobalt has class leading fuel economy starting in 2009 better than Civic, Corolla, and Focus. The Cobalt SS has 260hp/lb tq and gets 20/29 and for a car that does 0-60 in 5.65 and 14.0 quarter that is dang good

Malibu and Aura are 08 and 07 car of the year for N. America, Malibu beat out Accord!!! CTS is MT COTY, Lambdas are class leading and gaining sales upon sales by the day! Should GM's strategic plan have changed sooner? Yes, but do they offer competitive and in many instances class leading non-truck product, you bet your ass! You are so far off base that no one is buying their products THEY ARE SELLING WELL!!!!!!! Who wants an impala when you can get a Malibu? New Buick Ep2 is out this coming year as well as next-gen AURA. G6 is going on Alpha in a few years (thats a bad spot), but you really need to rethink your doom and gloom BS.

With Volt coming out in two years, I think your GM hating attitude will need to change as you are still being proven wrong today.

CobaltSS

Nice rebuttal. Its so true.