GM to add two models to new Oshawa car plant-report

[JT87]

Originally Posted by PontiacBixler

You guys just wait and see.....

Think about this:
-Why would GM make a blanket comment about "one unnamed vehicle"? They are being bland here because it is something that they feel could generate some buzz for the company. Otherwise they would have let the cat out of the bag this early.

-Bringing the Firebird out can only HELP GM. There is not a single negative connotation to bringing it out. It would help Pontiac by getting people into the showroom and bringing back that "excitement" feel and not the retarded "... is CAR" tagline.

-If there is ever a downtick in Camaro sales, then you increase production of Firebirds if the sales are there. Then should the Camaro start to show dominance over the Firebird, you do the exact same thing on the line. It keeps people employed, dealers happy and consumers coming to the showrooms.

-For all I know, it's the GTO that is coming back, but GM really botched the second coming in marketing. The GTO to the majority of the Millennial Gen'ers has the same appeal as Old Style Westerns did to Gen X'ers.... none at all. The Trans Am has a bit more of a stable base to relaunch from with name recognition over the last 20 years.

Just my thoughts.... so flame away.

The 'unnamed vehicle' and is most likely going to be a Cadillac or a Buick. The G/H/K/'whatever they call them now'-bodies are going out of production at Hamtramck within the next couple of years. A big RWD Cadillac (proper DTS replacement) and a big FWD Buick (proper Lucerne replacement; remember, there's a LOT of older people wouldn't buy a 370hp RWD Park Avenue, and would be happier to spend their money on an Avalon or an ES350) are the cars expected.

There would be no need to 'hide' a car such as the Firebird, especially if it was to be a mechanical copy of the Camaro (which it would be, though the Firebird will never happen). If it was to be an Alpha-based coupe with turbochargers and all wheel drive, then sure, there's reason to 'hide' the information. Spending the money to rebody the Camaro doesn't make sense, as the sports coupe market is already saturated, and the Pontiac wouldn't be sold globally, as the Camaro is. I don't see how an addition of MAYBE 15% of sales would warrant the MILLIONS of dollars in investment to reshape the body (I don't see how the Pontiac sales would 'be there' when the Camaro sales have 'down turned'). Bringing back the Firebird will only help PONTIAC, not GM.

Likewise, the GTO has a lot of appeal to people in my age group (not sure what 'generation' we'd qualify under, but i'll say 19-23). Where something like the Firebird/TA have always been overly agressive in the styling department, many people my age tend to gravitate to cars like the 3 series, the G, etc., cars that may not be the end all in exterior styling, but do everything else nearly perfectly. Sure, the GTO may be a tick slower than an '02WS6 T/A, but its a better car in leaps and bounds in every other way. It's a car that I wouldn't feel out of place parking in a wedding hall parking lot, yet still take to the track. Its some of those reasons, and others, that a GTO will be in my hands next May instead of a 'more agressive' and 'faster' F-body.

[PontiacBixler]

Originally Posted by JT87

Likewise, the GTO has a lot of appeal to people in my age group (not sure what 'generation' we'd qualify under, but i'll say 19-23). Where something like the Firebird/TA have always been overly agressive in the styling department, many people my age tend to gravitate to cars like the 3 series, the G, etc., cars that may not be the end all in exterior styling, but do everything else nearly perfectly. Sure, the GTO may be a tick slower than an '02WS6 T/A, but its a better car in leaps and bounds in every other way. It's a car that I wouldn't feel out of place parking in a wedding hall parking lot, yet still take to the track. Its some of those reasons, and others, that a GTO will be in my hands next May instead of a 'more agressive' and 'faster' F-body.

What 19-23 year old has the kind of money to afford a BMW or Infiniti?????

Unless of course the only "dirt under their finger nails" came from the weed they were rolling in their 400sq/ft bedroom in mommy and daddy's 3000sq/ft house in the gated community and don't need a real job because the family plan is to transition them into daddy's role of CEO when he retires in 10 years.....

All the kids in that group I've ever known are busting their asses trying to pay back college student loans that will have them in a solid grip until their mid 30's.

Obviously we come from distinctly different backgrounds and regions. I was raised in a Blue Collar home and became a White Collar myself.

[Lichtronamo]

A Firebird makes no sense given CAFE and that the Camaro is entering an already saturated market. The Buick/Cadillac Zeta was supposed to be at Hamatrack according to the "leaked" GM/UAW agreement, but it would seem logical to put all the Zetas in one plant.

[JT87]

Originally Posted by PontiacBixler

What 19-23 year old has the kind of money to afford a BMW or Infiniti?????

Unless of course the only "dirt under their finger nails" came from the weed they were rolling in their 400sq/ft bedroom in mommy and daddy's 3000sq/ft house in the gated community and don't need a real job because the family plan is to transition them into daddy's role of CEO when he retires in 10 years.....

All the kids in that group I've ever known are busting their asses trying to pay back college student loans that will have them in a solid grip until their mid 30's.

Obviously we come from distinctly different backgrounds and regions. I was raised in a Blue Collar home and became a White Collar myself.

First things first, I didn't intend on implying 19-23 year olds buying that class of car. But those who plan to be in good paying fields after university tend to look at getting something along these lines, albeit, 2-3 years used.

Secondly, let me tell you, surviving 3.5 years of engineering school while working 2 jobs in the meantime has its perks (only one and a half to go, woo hoo!). I work 2 well paying jobs (one at GM Oshawa, and I bartend as well). I also have ~20 hours a week of class, another 15 of lab, and working on a couple projects with the school as well takes a lot of time out of my life. I don't have the time to go out and party every week. Growing up, I didn't have anything paid for me. Oddly enough, for me, since I worked my high school life away, I made too much money to qualify for student loans, even though my parents' lowish income would have allowed me to get many grants and loans.

I inherited a 93 Grand Am about 5 years ago, that has cost me about $400+general maintenance, and I plan to keep it until it won't drive forward anymore. I keep my daily costs low (I split my internet with my roommates, I don't have television, car that is dirt cheap on gas and insurance, the only things I really spend my money on are food and tools, etc.). Working 2 jobs keeps me FAR away from having to touch the bank for student loans or lines of credit.

I, for one, have worked for everything I have. Because of this, I can afford a car like a GTO, or whatever pleases me. It will be a gift to myself for busting my ass working for 7 years, and being 90% done schooling (as well as being one of very few in the country with my degree). If you are indeed what you say you are, we're a little more alike than you think .

Back on topic, I'm waiting to hear news on exactly what is on its way to Oshawa, but I'm hopeful and grateful for the news.

[FenwickHockey65]

I'm holding out for RWD Impala.
But the unnamed car is most likely the G8.

[JT87]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

I'm holding out for RWD Impala.
But the unnamed car is most likely the G8.

The Impala is definitely staying FWD, and will be FWD for a while, as it looks.

Last I heard:
RWD Camaro
RWD 'car' to accompany the Camaro (hoping for the G8, but most likely be a Buick or a Cadillac)
FWD car in 2010, probably a extended EPII Chevy
FWD car in 2013, probably a Buick version of above

[Coloradokid]

My prediction for the four cars at Oshawa:

Camaro
Pontiac G8
FWD Buick Lucerne Replacement 2010
FWD Impala Replacement 2012

Zeta Cadillac is scheduled for Lansing Grand River

[Jesda]

FWD vehicles get better fuel economy less because of weight and more because of fewer driveline losses.

[johnstarnes]

Originally Posted by PontiacBixler

How can no one have guessed the answer as it stares us in the face?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
What car would GM NOT tell us about at this moment in time???
Think.....
Think.....
A little bit more....
Almost there.......

The Firebird guys!

GM won't announce the Firebird until NAIAS 2010 and then release it that Fall as a 2011 or 2012 model. Cost saving measures to help the initial cost of the Camaro!

That would be awesome if they held SUCH a hot card close to their chest all this time! I want a SLEEK FUTURISTIC Firebird! Watch one of the cars turn out to be an Aveo with a CTS style nose clip!

[HotCarNut]

Originally Posted by johnstarnes

That would be awesome if they held SUCH a hot card close to their chest all this time! I want a SLEEK FUTURISTIC Firebird! Watch one of the cars turn out to be an Aveo with a CTS style nose clip!

and then there were two.......

I guess johnstarnes and pontiacbixler have been passing the bottle back and forth...easy on the "Kool-Aid" boys.....