Democrats press for car industry rescue

[stormwatcher]

The government can help GM out with financing when they are in Chapter 11 as companies always need financing to emerge from Chapter 11.

As for warranties, maybe the government could guarantee GM's warranties.

[2b2]

altho it wouldn't be as simple as throwing a lump of bailout bucks at the problem,
I wonder if several specific fixes could be implemented?

- Have the gov'mint take-up-the-slack with the new UAW contracts
ie pay the difference to the workers until the new deals go into effect
imho that'd seem less like a mfg-bailout & more like "protecting our workers"

- Provide not only funds but a way to achieve Some of the benefits of ch11 without declaring bankruptcy
(dunno if that could be done legally)
thinking of mgescuro's list
___GM could use bankruptcy to eliminated non-performing dealerships and halve the entire network.
___GM could use bankruptcy to eliminate the fixed and overhead costs.
___GM could use bankruptcy to eliminate the UAW.
___GM could potentially have a clean slate.
(these would have to be avail to Chrysler & Ford too, imho)

- (maybe) level the execs' salaries (corp&union) to the same as the highest-paid assemblyline worker for the 'duration'
...wonder if Mr.Wagoner would still stay? ...bet Mr.Lutz would


actually what I'd prefer, is for the 'playing-field' to get leveled, even if it can't be 'phrased' that way due to political cr@p (betwn states ie franchise laws, as well as with the foreign state-supported brands & those closed-to-US markets)
&
a breathing-space made possible...
...during which other measures could be worked out to further-postpone-or-avoid any death-sentence decisions
^which^
would possibly/hopefully include a sales-channel/product re-organization
(pet peave: imho GM can't tell the diff. betwn a Division / a Brand / a Nameplate / and a rebadge
hint: the first 2 are fictitious)
&
at least give the Detroit 3 a fresh chance to earn their survival or death


all^ just imho & NOT a complete list by Any means

[Hurricane]

Originally Posted by KingElvis

Would you buy a car from a bankrupt auto company though?

Heck, I am not sure I would buy from a non-bankrupt auto company like GM right now, consider the state it is in, and five of the last six cars I bought new were GM products...

[BusyBody]

Well all of these awesome imports come at a price. Not to say GM hasn't made mistakes, but ultimately people need to realize as long as they finance overseas jobs over their own, bailouts may be a reality. Even if the bailout doesn't happen, taxpayers will pay will unemployment insurance, etc, which will likely be much more costly. There really is no simple answer when there are so many jobs on the line.

[BusyBody]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Yes. You're absolutely right.

But how much more of this bailout nonsense must the country endure?

Realistically, Detroit needs to go to Chapter 11 and really, truly organize themselves for the future.

They cannot go on with the tremendous fixed costs and liabilities they have endured for decades.

GM is still built like a company with a 35% market share for crying out loud.

What will a bailout do? It will just buy them some time.

Chapter 11 is really the only cure for Detroit, despite its negative consequences. And that's the scary part about it all. Do we push the automakers into bankruptcy now, so they can reorganize themselves fully, in order to come out of this downturn stronger than ever? Or do we simply buy them enough time and keep them on life support??

Perhaps GM going into Chapter 11 won't be such a bad thing, if the government gave them AIG-like bailout money!!!???? $85 billion in loans, while in bankruptcy court, ensures GM's survival, while the reorganize the divisions properly. A judge will also then be able to make sure that the product strategies and business plans are in place.

But how do they mitigate the negative impact of a chapter 11??
Your guess is as good as mine.

This sounds like a good idea, but what about all of the unemployment as a result of Chp 11? I suspect that would cost more than the loan forgiveness, otherwise the government would likely let GM fail. Its not like GM has much political clout anymore, so it must come down to money.

[RamJet502]

I guess we can all hope and pray that a "rescue" will work but unless the fundamentals of the American Auto Industry change a "rescue" will only delay the inevitable.

[96_impala_ss]

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Yes. You're absolutely right.

But how much more of this bailout nonsense must the country endure?

Realistically, Detroit needs to go to Chapter 11 and really, truly organize themselves for the future.

They cannot go on with the tremendous fixed costs and liabilities they have endured for decades.

GM is still built like a company with a 35% market share for crying out loud.

What will a bailout do? It will just buy them some time.

Chapter 11 is really the only cure for Detroit, despite its negative consequences. And that's the scary part about it all. Do we push the automakers into bankruptcy now, so they can reorganize themselves fully, in order to come out of this downturn stronger than ever? Or do we simply buy them enough time and keep them on life support??

Perhaps GM going into Chapter 11 won't be such a bad thing, if the government gave them AIG-like bailout money!!!???? $85 billion in loans, while in bankruptcy court, ensures GM's survival, while the reorganize the divisions properly. A judge will also then be able to make sure that the product strategies and business plans are in place.

But how do they mitigate the negative impact of a chapter 11??
Your guess is as good as mine.

What if the Big 3 didnt file for Chapter 11 but rather granted benefits from Chapter 11 without declaring bankruptcy? The bad part of declaring bankruptcy is the stigma that comes with bankruptcy. One thing is for sure though, Wagoner and Nardelli need to go. After the govt grants them defacto bankruptcy, there should be new CEOs that are more skilled than these scumbags and bring back the companies to prosperity.

[BuickBoy]

Why can't we be more creative than buyout. How about the Government buys another 2 million cars for the GSA. At least we will have something to show fot it.

[pwoods]

Originally Posted by 96_impala_ss

What if the Big 3 didnt file for Chapter 11 but rather granted benefits from Chapter 11 without declaring bankruptcy? The bad part of declaring bankruptcy is the stigma that comes with bankruptcy.

I could see the government doing this, though for other reasons besides worrying about GMs reputation. If GM were to file Chapter 11, would that not give them the power to start reneging on obligations to their unions? A GM bailout would have almost zero to do with saving a large American auto manufacturer, and almost everything to do with saving union jobs.

[ronald mcretard]

I think "bailout" is the way to go... remember, GM/F/C wouldn't be doing so bad if the credit crisis and everything else was not so bad. Sure, they wouldn't be doing GREAT, but they were all in the midst of turnarounds when the stuff hit the fan. With enough money in the bank to weather the storm for the next year or so, I think they will all come out OK.

[gmparts]

How ironic is it that democrats are now calling for a federal bailout of an industry they don't even support! More import owners are dems, maybe they should try buying an American vehicle for a change. Lay off the Accords and Camrys!

[skylark68]

Originally Posted by BuickBoy

Why can't we be more creative than buyout. How about the Government buys another 2 million cars for the GSA. At least we will have something to show fot it.

Good idea!

[kenmi]

It's almost funny that the media is just now talking about how many jobs would be lost. Just think how many jobs have already been lost! If the media and elite liberals had supported this industry to begin with we would now have a very strong industry, and billions of national wealth would be here, not in China etc. The auto industry has been fire-fighting for years to fight government sponsored foreign companies that used slave labor, and the unions have been fighting to save a living wage, and health insurance, while the elites have been throwing it all away. But where was the constant carping about executive, and professional salaries? Which reached insane levels while they condemed blue collar workers.

[PAULSTS1]

Originally Posted by ronald mcretard

I think "bailout" is the way to go... remember, GM/F/C wouldn't be doing so bad if the credit crisis and everything else was not so bad. Sure, they wouldn't be doing GREAT, but they were all in the midst of turnarounds when the stuff hit the fan. With enough money in the bank to weather the storm for the next year or so, I think they will all come out OK.

They were all selling millions of cars, but not making a profit before the Credit Crisis! With the Crisis as a permanent issue, their losses will accelerate. That means they have less time than they stated! A bailout will just keep the lights burning for a month or so longer, then we'll get stuck with much higher taxes forever! Is it worth it to you?

[wescoent]

Bankruptcy is a bad idea, but it is NOT inevitable. There are creative ways to get around it.

One is my corporate breakup concept. Spin GM's vast organization off into a confederacy of limited liability corporations.

Sell GMAC to Cerberus, and start a new finance company from scratch.

Sell all of GM's brands to a new company, GM Asset Management.

Sell all of GM's vehicle development ops to a new company, Fisher Design and Engineering.

Pool the manufacturing plants and labor contracts into a renamed corporate entity, GM Assembly, which will be the same corporate entity as the current GM Corporate. Then, have this entity declare bankruptcy, have a new LLC buy all of the assets at firesale prices from the bankruptcy court, and we go from there.