Cost Of New Duramax Diesel May Increase By $3000

[Perian]

Link: www.automotivenews.com

DETROIT -- General Motors plans a series of expensive changes to its Duramax V-8 engine to cope with tough U.S. diesel emission rules taking effect Jan. 1.

GM says reworking the 6.6-liter diesel, which powers heavy-duty versions of the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra pickups, won't interrupt production. But the modifications are expected to sharply increase the cost of building the engine.

GM will significantly revamp the emissions system of the Duramax, which also is used in full-sized vans and commercial vehicles. GM Powertrain spokeswoman Susan Garavaglia said the diesel will meet the 2007 regulations with:

* A new variable geometry turbocharger.

* Enhanced exhaust gas recirculation.

* Closed crankcase ventilation system.

* Changes to the exhaust system that include an oxidizing catalytic converter to clean NOx emissions and a particulate filter to lower soot.

Diesel particulate filters, first used in Europe in 2005 on Peugeot and Citroen vehicles, will land in America for the first time on diesel versions of the Mercedes-Benz E320 and the Jeep Grand Cherokee coming this fall.

The new Duramax developed to meet the emissions regulation won't be available until Jan. 1.

GM's upgrades won't be cheap. The particulate filter and oxidizing catalytic converter, for example, could add at least $3,000 to the cost of building the truck.

The estimate is based on hardware costs for older diesels that have been retrofitted with filters and related equipment. GM won't confirm the figures.

Demand is strong for GM's diesel trucks. Capacity from the lone Moraine, Ohio, plant that builds the engine is limited to about 180,000 units a year. Because the Duramax has built a reputation for being smooth, quiet and reliable, GM sells out of diesel trucks each year and gets close to sticker prices, which start at about $30,000 and can go as high as $50,000.

GM's technical solutions differ from what sources say Ford Motor Co., Volkswagen and DaimlerChrysler plan for diesel powerplants in the United States. Ford will launch a revamped Power Stroke diesel truck engine in the first quarter of 2007 that uses piezoelectric fuel injectors.

[Perian]

Anyone else notice that the cost and operation of future diesels is starting to make the economic case for hybrid vehicles look good?

In addition, wait until they price the low sulfur diesel product itself!

This may not be the answer we have been looking for.

[TaHoE]

Originally Posted by Perian

Anyone else notice that the cost and operation of future diesels is starting to make the economic case for hybrid vehicles look good?

In addition, wait until they price the low sulfur diesel product itself!

This may not be the answer we have been looking for.

Not necessarily. This engine is expensive because of the technology needed to make it more powerful and efficient. The current lineup of diesels are already as powerful and sometimes more powerful than a Hybrid, are just as efficient and cost much less. This engine is totally different. There isn't going to be a Hybrid Heavy Duty Pickup....they need diesels. However this price is a bit steep....this better be one Helluva engine.

[ponchoman49]

Maybe they can reconfigure equipment on the trucks to lower prices a little to help compensate.

[momo67]

I think that $3000 figure is exaggerated for effect. The true cost is probably closer to $1000, but the tree huggers who come up with these rules never seem to consider the cost. Since NHTSA and the EPA started their health and safety campaigns in the 70s, an average of $5000 has been added to the cost of every vehicle sold in the States. Now I'm all in favor of airbags, ABS and other stuff that helps keep me alive, but that's a lot of money and they keep adding to it all the time. So don't just blame the car companies when things get more expensive.

[Havasavana]

Originally Posted by momo67

I think that $3000 figure is exaggerated for effect. The true cost is probably closer to $1000, but the tree huggers who come up with these rules never seem to consider the cost. Since NHTSA and the EPA started their health and safety campaigns in the 70s, an average of $5000 has been added to the cost of every vehicle sold in the States. Now I'm all in favor of airbags, ABS and other stuff that helps keep me alive, but that's a lot of money and they keep adding to it all the time. So don't just blame the car companies when things get more expensive.

So maybe you'd care to explain in detail just what pollution reductions you'd like to see eliminated. Remember when the semis blew black smoke constantly? Or when the city buses running nose to tail belched blue and black smoke into the haze that everyone had to breath? Or when the paper mills and power generation plants made life next to intolerable for people living within miles? There is very strong evidence that ozone is a causing agent in children developing asthma. In cities with poor air, it's not uncommon that people are advised to stay indoors on days of high pollution. Bring back the good old day, huh?

[Maxxer442]

I guess asthma has only been around since the invention of smog, huh? Get a grip-none of us want smog and smoke in our faces. He's just saying that if people want 400 horse diesel trucks that meet crazy strict emissions, then ya gotta pay for them. It's not the manufacturer's fault it costs so much-but the laws that constantly change. I'm sure its not gonna cost $3000 for this stuff, but if thats what it takes for the DMax to stay competitive, so be it.

[Havasavana]

Originally Posted by Maxxer442

I guess asthma has only been around since the invention of smog, huh? Get a grip-none of us want smog and smoke in our faces. He's just saying that if people want 400 horse diesel trucks that meet crazy strict emissions, then ya gotta pay for them. It's not the manufacturer's fault it costs so much-but the laws that constantly change. I'm sure its not gonna cost $3000 for this stuff, but if thats what it takes for the DMax to stay competitive, so be it.

I know you CAN read so you know I did not say asthma did not exist prior to humanly generated smog. I agree that frequent changes in legal requirements add to cost, but there are reasons for these changes. First the science changes as does the ability to reduce pollution. And a very important factor is the lobbying done by the auto and energy companies. Low-sulfur diesel has been available in Europe for years so the lack of availability here is not a matter of technology but rather lobbying, i.e.; bribes to politicians. I hope GM doesn't raise the prices of the Duramax by anything like $3k unless Ford and Dodge to the same. GM has a great opportunity to pick up market share if Ford stumbles with their diesel.

[benroethig]

Originally Posted by Perian

Anyone else notice that the cost and operation of future diesels is starting to make the economic case for hybrid vehicles look good?

In addition, wait until they price the low sulfur diesel product itself!

This may not be the answer we have been looking for.

When one of those hybrids can haul five tons, let me know.

[Ultra Magnus]

Another $3K for the Dmax is a bit excessive. I doubt it will get to that level but I can see $1k extra for them. They may be the best in the business but if no one wants to spend that much on the engine then they wont sell.

[Duramaximum]

If you can already afford a Duramax, an extra $3000 probably won't matter if that's what you really want.

[Aerodynamix]

Originally Posted by Duramaximum

If you can already afford a Duramax, an extra $3000 probably won't matter if that's what you really want.

You're probably right, but it's still a bit of a hike and Joe Public will just see it as a price hike by GM and there will undoubtably be some resentment.

However, I think this price hike is only for the next one or two model years since I think the modifications the Duramax is getting in January '07 is only until all-new/purpose built components are used instead of these retrofits. I'm positive diesels still have a prominent place in our future.

[mkaresh]

These figures are always inflated. Airbags, catalytic converters, etc., have increased the prices of cars, but not nearly by as much as manufacturers said they would.

Also note that this is the cost of retrofitting an old diesel. It always costs a lot more to retrofit an existing car/engine than to do something different when the car/engine is first built.

Even $1,000 is probably high.

[kenman923]

A pretty penny to modify the diesel for emission control standards.

[Geotpf]

Originally Posted by momo67

I think that $3000 figure is exaggerated for effect. The true cost is probably closer to $1000, but the tree huggers who come up with these rules never seem to consider the cost. Since NHTSA and the EPA started their health and safety campaigns in the 70s, an average of $5000 has been added to the cost of every vehicle sold in the States. Now I'm all in favor of airbags, ABS and other stuff that helps keep me alive, but that's a lot of money and they keep adding to it all the time. So don't just blame the car companies when things get more expensive.

I'm sorry, I like to be able to breathe. I have lived in Riverside, CA, pollution capital of the country, all my life, and the difference in air quality from the 1980's to now is dramatic, and tough pollution laws, on vehicles and other things, are the cause of this.