Consumer Reports Best Cars 2005

[goblue]

http://money.cnn.com/2005/03/04/pf/a...ex.htm?cnn=yes

DETROIT, March 4 (Reuters) - Japanese automobiles are the true kings of the road, judging by the latest annual "Best Cars" issue of Consumer Reports magazine, which hits newsstands next week.

All but one of the vehicles in the magazine's list of "top picks" in 10 different categories for 2005 are Japanese. The exception is Ford's small-sized Focus sedan.

Japanese vehicles also score a clean sweep on a list of 21 vehicles that Consumer Reports says it can recommend because they earned "very good" or "excellent" scores in all five major ratings areas it tested.

The recommendations are important since the spring auto issue from Consumer Reports, which accepts no paid advertising or free samples of the products its reviews, has long been seen as a trusted shopping guide by many U.S. car buyers.

Anything that could accelerate the rate of defection away from Detroit's mass market automakers is clearly bad news for the likes of General Motors Corp. and Ford Motor Co. as they continue to lose market share to fast-growing foreign rivals.

The Big Three can take solace, however, from a Consumer Reports survey showing for the second consecutive year that the average domestic car is more reliable than its average European counterpart.

That trend, which gives Detroit at least some bragging rights, was reported by Consumer Reports for the first time in 24 years in its previous auto issue, in 2004.

Reliability results this year were based on responses from Consumer Report subscribers about a record 810,000 privately owned or leased cars and trucks.

Japanese and Korean automakers once again produced the most trouble-free models, with an overall problem rate of 12 per 100 for the 2004 model year, the same rate they have had for the last three years, Consumer Reports said.

It said GM, Ford and the Chrysler side of DaimlerChrysler AG inched closer to the Asians with an overall problem rate of 17 per 100, however. That matched the industry average and was down from a combined rate of 18 per 100 last year.

By contrast, the problem rate for European automakers rose slightly to 21 per 100 from 20 last year.

"Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen, and Volvo had more than their fair share of problems. Only Audi came out better than average," the magazine said.

"The most reliable brand overall is now Subaru, which averages eight problems per 100," Consumer Reports said. It noted that Honda Motor Co. Ltd., long a reliability leader, now averaged nine problems per 100.

The single most reliable vehicle in the 2004 model year was Hyundai Motor Co, Ltd's low-cost Sonata sedan, with a problem rate of just two per 100.

The showing "further establishes Hyundai's remarkable turnaround from one of the least reliable brands to one of the best," Consumer Reports said of the Korean automaker.

Ford's Lincoln Navigator sport utility vehicle and Nissan's Quest minivan tied for most unreliable vehicle, it said, with problem rates of 49 per 100. Close behind was the pricey Touareg SUV from Volkswagen AG, which had 48 problems for every 100 vehicles.

[goblue]

- Not a single GM vehicle on the list, out of the ten best - and the 21 most recommended.

- Hyaundai Sonata most reliable. By a large margin?

- Subaru most reliable brand, Toyota beneath Honda?

- Naviagator and Quest most unreliable vehicles?

- Domestics close on Japanese for second straight year - europeans get worse.

I'm sorry, but maybe their aggregated data somewhat makes sense, but their statistical methods - long lambasted on this site - leave something to be desired.

I truly believe the best thing GM could do for their marketshare is find a way to nail this magazine. There ought to be a team working on it. Much of their stats are not in congruence with multiple automotive publications - only their broadest, overall data (*** vs Euro vs American) seems to make any sense.

What I'd like to know - and what will never be published, is the breakout of vehicles represented in the survey relative to the number of vehicles sold. CP is sort of like a self fulfullling prophecy. They only survey their readers, and only those that actually take the time to return the thing, who most likely trust their ratings.

[Kar Krazie]

We used to get consumer reports at my house and then my dad canceled it. We realized just how biased they are towards GM. They would give a report on say a Geo Prizm and a Toyota Corolla. Essentially the same car. But they would say the Geo is unreliable and cheap but the Corolla was just perfect.

[mk1700]

I dont get it. You got a lot of "Consumer information" on the USA, but nobody belives it!
Then whats the use of it?
On the other hand GM has to open their eyes: Many people think that the GM cars are just bad done and expensive.
If nobody does something, in a short time Toyota, Honda and BMW are gonna be the Big 3!

[vdoh182]

i hate how they say japanese and korean, they r gorifying asia, hyundai got better, thats it, kia still blows, and hyundai got better intitial quality and i really doubt itll have good long term durability.

[Infiniti Z350]

One thing that bothers me about Consumer Reports is that they like to predict reliablity of the next model year of a car without knowing what or if rectifications to issues to previous model years have been made unless it's a redesigned model.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by mk1700

On the other hand GM has to open their eyes: Many people think that the GM cars are just bad done and expensive.

I don't know how anyone could come to the conclusion that GM cars are badly done and expensive. Generally, their products are very very value-oriented, offering the most content and performance per dollar. Take the Corvette as a prime example. In addition, GM offers remarkable rebates and offers 0% financing on most of their models. In terms of reliability and consumer satisfaction, Buick, Cadillac, and Saturn consistently receive high satisfaction ratings and you can even see in the above article how Subaru (in which GM holds a 25% share) is the top make overall. For these reasons alone, I would never buy anything but GM.

[uujjj]

CR's predicted reliability is often off, but their reliability survey (for used cars) is very accurate. They need to take into account that reliability improves for models in their second year of production when they make their predictions (e.g. redesigned 2004 Malibu was below average but the 2005 probably won't be).

GM has been building junk for 20 years. It'll take a while for the bad taste to leave the CR editors' mouths. GM, of course, could accelerate the process by building new cars that are clearly class leaders rather than merely competitive like the G6/LaCrosse/Equinox. And cut your dam prices!

[Jay]

Originally Posted by goblue

[url]
The exception is Ford's small-sized Focus sedan.

You've gotta be kidding me. This is a typo, right? I've known half a dozen people who've driven Focuses (Foci?) and they've all said they were complete crap. My girlfriend's mom had a 2005 Focus wagon rental car for 2 weeks last December and the heat stopped working on it. And the car only had 120 kilometres on the odometer!

[86fleet]

I probaly can't say how I feel about consumer reports without getting in trouble, so a simlie has to be worth a 1000 words...
CR=

[SUPERBADD75]

you know, Consumer Reports is worthless. it doesn't offer a large enough cross section of people, and most people are generally biased toward what they own if they've had a good experience with it. if someone buys Brand X and it's been a good car with a few minor troubles, like a loose piece of trim or something, and then they get a car from Brand Y and it has a tranny go out in the first 15k or so, then they're going to be furious about Brand Y and give it terrible reviews, and then probably go back to Brand X when they purchase their next car. now, we all know that every now and then every manufacturer gets a bad batch of something. it doesn't matter if it's a little traction control module, or door lock switches, or even transmissions, every now and then a manufacturer gets some bad ones from a supplier and it's not their fault. usually a bulleting goes out and it gets fixed, no problem, but most people don't understand that and rip the brand to shreds for a problem. if it's build quality, and something is obviously scabbed together poorly and the car is just a heap, then fine, tear into it. if you have a mechanical problem every now and then, remember that there are still humans involved in manufacturing processes, and humans make mistakes.

what i mean by this is that when you leave ratings in the hands of consumers, there are all kinds of factors that skew the results.

[ghughes]

gm should have a statistician look at the methodologies used here - CR doesnt accept ads - but i wonder what they do accept from japan inc. for all of their glorious studies lo these past 10 years

[GM_Guy81]

I have no faith in consumer reports. I worked in the computer department at Best Buy for 4 years while I was in college. The consistantly gave Lexmark printers the CR best Buy, those were perhaps the worst printers I have ever laid eyes on. Regardless of whatever I told the customer, trying to talk them into an HP or something, they always just came back to "well Consumer reports said its great..." So I would just let them buy it. I cannot even explain to you how many of those people who wouldnt listen to me were back within the week to exchange it for an HP. At least 50%.

[Retroman]

My Dad first saw value in CR mag back in the 70's. Since that time I have off and on subscribed but with regularity the last 7 years. I use CR as a guide when purchasing goods and services. No one source should be used, after all CR is not a "bible" but rather a tool or aid.
With respect to CR's auto rating I see it this way,.....the best rated car for that year sets the height of the bar that all the rest have to compete against. Example,...a 2005 Malibu having 8 problems out of 100 cars (hypothetical) may have reliability equal to a 2002 Honda Civic, while the 2005 Honda Civic just improved to 6 problems out of 100 cars giving the allusion that the Malibu is not so good. Malibu could in fact be having one of it's best ratings that year but you wouldn't know it because the bar was moved so high up because of an outstanding rating on some other make.

A big factor is the type of problem being rated. Just simply using red and black dots to point out good and bad in a car is a bit simplistic. All cars have TSB's written up against them. No manufacturer escapes them. I own a Tundra, Frontier and a Chrysler T&C, They all have numerous TSB's but somehow they stay on the road.

Stiff competition makes manufacturers better which in turn gives us better products. What is missing in the CR ratings IMHO is the fact that the vast majority of cars are improving year after year as well as customer service if problems do arise. Again CR is not a bible but just a company that rates stuff a little too simplistically with respect to automobiles. Don't get me started on the politics of CR which I feel makes them a shade biased, IMHO.

[SonicAerio]

Us Suzuki fans have lost faith in them since the late 80s when they attempted to destroy the reputation of Suzuki through the Samuri. They not only changed the course out line that they tested all others that day on, but also drove it crazily, then denying that fact. Not to mention it was caught on video that one of the Consumer testers stated they were not leaving untill they lift a wheel and tested it 3x more then the other vehicles in the test. After all their advertising about it, Suzuki sales fell from 90,000+ vehicles a year to less then 30,000. If not for them, Suzuki could of been a power in low priced entry level cars. Now that it is settled, Suzuki is starting to address the performance and sportness they lacked. They have always had very reliable cars, and even after CR deemed them a danger to people the rest of the world (including Europe) continued to sell them another 10 years untill a replacement came out.

I think that CR is paid by companies to sway statistics, if not Honda or Toyata now, it had to be an American manufacturer back in the 80s.... Think about it, a sporty $9,000 samuri SUV, vs the larger way more expensive SUVs of the past would of caused waves. It all makes sense, CR does nothing more then pass around propaganda of whoever pays them. I never trust CR, if I ever want to look at vehicles and comparisons, I go to Edmunds, where I can read peoples personal experiences and get unbiased data.