Americans Don't Love Trucks Anymore

[motorman]

most all the used trucks at the dealership did not have a scatch in the beds because they never hauled anything. my silverado is 20 years old this year and i am waiting for someone to trade on a nice ext cab 8' bed so i can replace it. i just use my truck to haul our quads to our place in the mountains so it sets most of the time. the $$$ i save buying a used one will buy lots of gasoline

[ponyok67]

Trucks aren’t going anywhere. The market will fluctuate and shift around. Power trains will change, design and content will be market driven, customer base may change, but trucks and specifically the pickup will be forever. The evolution is already in motion, maybe not full bloom, but trucks will survive.

[PhishPhood]

Originally Posted by tgagneguam

Does the cost of insurance and taxes on two cars plus the cost for gas for a more fuel efficient car still come to less than what it would cost to simply pay the taxes and insurance on one vehicle that gets lesser fuel economy? I don't know, but it sounds like it might be too close to call, depending on how much your father drives.

It strikes me as odd that someone would spend thousands on another car to save money on gas, particularly when you now have another tax bill and insurance bill.

Sort of reminds me of someone who bragged about her husband paying 6 cents less per gallon for gasoline that required a 30-minute round trip to obtain. I summed it up simply: "So, your husband spent 30 minutes roundtrip to save approximately 90 cents to fill up your car?! He mustn't make much per hour to see that as a good use of half an hour of his life."

Obviously it doesn't make sense from a purely financial comparo aspect but there is also the very basic concept that people are free to spend their money as they wish whether it's on trips to Vegas, investments in penny stocks, a massive CD collection, etc etc.

Yes to minimize total transportation costs it makes sense to trade in the pickup and buy a used compact. But that may have repercussions on other aspects of family life and personal enjoyment. Keeping the pickup or SUV when it comes time to replace it and getting a more efficient daily driver seems like a smart move to me. Then one has a lot of options available.

[61BelAir]

I still love trucks and last time I looked I was an American. I do plan on getting myself another full size truck, but not until I have myself a economy car to go along with it for daily use.

[PhishPhood]

Originally Posted by ponyok67

Trucks aren’t going anywhere. The market will fluctuate and shift around. Power trains will change, design and content will be market driven, customer base may change, but trucks and specifically the pickup will be forever. The evolution is already in motion, maybe not full bloom, but trucks will survive.

There is no question that they will suvive it's just that they won't be as widespread as in the 90s. When I grew up in the 50's and 60s there were few if any around. Most were used on farms and by workers in the building trades. We are probably going back to this balance.

Instead of 2.5 million full sized trucks1.2 to 1.5 million sounds about right to me. $55000 crewcabs with movie theaters inside as a daily driver?

I'm surprised that the small truck segment is doing so poorly. I'd think that people getting out of big trucks would move to smaller ones. But it appears that the buyers are just skipping over this segment entirely and going directly to cars.

Businesses and the buyers who really need trucks are generally keeping the full-sized ones and 're-upping' when it makes sense. Wannabee and appearance buyers apparently are just unloading them for good. $55000 for a crewcab with a movie theater inside as a daily driver?

[Olds88]

Originally Posted by PhishPhood

The NA buying public is speaking forcefully with it's wallet. The vehicle makers know this very very well from their own monthly sales stats. It's easy to track.

Yes it is, its saying trucks are no longer "cool". But they're still necessary. The less trucks sold the better I say. If the volume for my Avalanche gets lower maybe GM can keep the gasoline V8 under its hood for me

Originally Posted by PhishPhood

Midsized BOF SUVs like the iconic Explorer, Durango/Aspen, TrailBlazer/Envoy, 4Runner/FJ and Pathfinder are finished ... DOA. At best a couple will remain as niche vehicles for the hardcore offroader. The others will be retired or remade as crossovers.

Trailblazer continues to sell quite well (better than Acadia) despite being an old model. The TB is a logical step-down from a Tahoe if you need to tow, and FWD unitbody mommywagon isn't.

Originally Posted by PhishPhood

Fullsized BOF SUVs are on life support. The Escalades, Tahoe/Yukon, Expedition, Armada and soon the Sequoia are no longer symbols of 'having made it'. They too will become niche vehicles as family movers that can tow. But the new class of crossovers like the Lambda's are better as just people movers. When the 2-Modes are dropped into the Lambdas it will really goose sales.

People define better in different ways. Every unibody CUV i've ever ridden in rides like garbage and feels out of control wile towing. Even if I didn't tow I will ALWAYS but a long wheel base BOF vehicle. There are no BOF cars left, so I'm stuck with SUVs. I hate the short, sloped hoods on the Lambdas, the lame sounding DOHC V6, the lack of a shifter on the steering column where it belongs in a vehicle that's supposed to be for utility, the weaker body structure that doesn't feel confident when loaded with materials for a weekend project, the narrowness of the vehicle etc. I'd be content with a large WIDE body-on-frame station wagon (I love my Caprice) but they don't exist. And no unibody vehicle can replace an RWD BOF for my tastes.

Originally Posted by PhishPhood

Certain people will always need a truck. But they will need it for work, not as a statement of ruggedness.

Some need it for play. I bought a truck not as a status sybmol, for the image or anything like that. I wanted a roomy, wide, V8 powered RWD BOF vehicle. I didn't want a sedan because there's no usable room in a sedan so the Crown Vic was out. That left me with either Tahoe, Suburban, Avalanche, or Expedition. I decided on Avalanche over Tahoe because the bed is useful for hauling an ATV as well as wood, landscaping supplies, etc. Additionally the 130" wheelbase combined with the BOF build, wideness of the vehicle and softness of the suspension gives it an amazing ride quality that no car built today can match. I enjoy the driving dynamics of a truck, maybe not as much as a muscle car, but far more than anything that's FWD. I love the sound of a pushrod V8. Whiny DOHC V6 motors annoy me. The only V6 i've liked the sound of is the 4.3L pushrod V6 used in the Chevy S10 vehicles.

Originally Posted by mgescuro

Why are people surprised? We knew this was going to happen 2-3 years ago!!!
At least GM launched their new trucks a few years ago, so they can now concentrate on new CARS.

I don't believe trucks will go away. But trucks as we know it -- large, hulking behemoths will probably go away from normal use and be reserved for more commercials uses. If you want a truck these days, it's most likely going to be a compact to mid-size one. Unfortunately, GM and Ford gave up that market to the imports YEARS ago.

This shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.

What will happen is those who bought them to be seen by other people in them won't buy them anymore. Those who buy them for what they are and specifically seek certain traits they exhibit will continue to buy them.

Originally Posted by Generous Motors

Phish, Yes sales are down in all segments not just trucks, so that 1 million who didn't buy a truck also just flat didn't buy any new vehicle. I doubt trucks will ever come back to the heights they once occupied in sales volume, but like said nothing will get some of the jobs done like a full size truck. I personally believe that it is just the economy and that the soft full size truck owners can't justify owning a 5000 lbs V8 car with an open trunk.

Trucks are returning to their pre-SUV fad sales numbers. Just like minivans spiked and fell.

Originally Posted by silvergoat2k6

Well, just do the math...a 30-gallon tank would cost anywhere from $120-$150 to fill up with gas at $4-$5/gal (don't laugh, we'll be there sooner than you think)...and at 10-14 real-world mpg, it costs some serious money if you're putting any kind of mileage on them. Plus, last I checked they weren't exactly cheap to buy and/or insure.

It's kind of a mixed bag...on one hand, I'm glad to see people getting out of big gas-guzzling trucks and suv's that they really don't need...on the other hand, we all know that GM, Ford, and Chrysler rely on these full-size trucks and suv's for the majority of their profits, and I just don't see how GM, Ford, or Chrysler will ever make any money in America if they can't continue to sell the large number of full-size trucks and suv's they're used to selling every year.

If we all drove what we "need" we'd be in tiny slow unsafe crackerboxes. A vehicle is in and of itself a luxury. Some prefer different things. Those who by them just to be seen in them shouldn't. But those of us (like me) who buy them for what they are and wouldn't be happy with anything else will continue to buy them.

As for insurance rates, pickup trucks are actually fairly cheap to insure. 10-14mpg real world? I don't even think Tundra's that bad. I do better than 10-14 when I'm burning ethanol ($2.75 a gallon baby!). In consistent highway driving at 65mph I can easily average 22mpg. In city driving I get 14mpg at the absolute worse, 17mpg is average. Combined for me is around 19 (20/80 city/hwy split).

Originally Posted by VCDJ

Like i said who is crazy to buy a truck when price of gas is almost $4 and it will go up every year. Businesses will always need a truck. But why do people buy then that just go to an office job is just crazy. Why would you want to waste so much money on fuel and truck. There are better ways to spend it.

I commute to the office in a truck. But on the weekends my truck hauls a boat the the lake or an ATV to the trail. It brings home supplies and materials to landscape the yard. My truck takes myself and four other grown men on a road trip to go fishing/camping. I can't afford to buy a Cobalt to drive to work everyday. It's cheaper just to pay for the truck's fuel costs.

Also that's just your opinion that spending money to drive something you want is stupid. Is buying an inefficient german sports car also stupid then by that logic? People are willing to spend money for something they enjoy, for me and others its a truck. Many people will blow $80 in one weekend out drinking. I could never fathom wasting money on something like getting intoxicated, but that doesn't mean others don't enjoy it. $80 is more than my weekly gas budget.

Originally Posted by tkrelston

I think the fact that trucks are generally $ 10 grand over priced has a big part of why they aren’t selling as well. Many truck buyers simply can’t afford a $50,000 dollar Duramax, especially when considering current financial woes and prices!

Trucks are horribly overpriced I'll agree. The reason they were popular in the distant past is because they were cheap reliable transportation. Now they're reliable, but not cheap. Though at $36k my Avalanche was still worth it (especially considering a similarly equipped silverado crew cab was virtually the same price).

Originally Posted by stevews602

Detroit made a ton of money selling overpriced SUV’s and trucks to yokels who thought it was cool to drive the latest fad.
Now with skyrocketing gas prices and a renewed “green” movement they will all buy the new fad, overpriced hybrids.
At least for those out there who actually need truck, they’ll get a great deal on a new or used one.

Amen! I hope my next Avalanche costs me a more realistic $30k reasonably equipped.

[CaptainDan]

There are some people who really, and truly NEED a large truck. There are some people who really, and truly can't afford to waste the money on the fuel for anything more than an Aveo.

The rest of the car/truck market (vast majority) have as "one" of their main concerns, IMAGE. (I know, there are other concerns too, but stay with me here) Do you really think that somebody spending an extra 10-20 grand for that monster-sized truck will trade down to save one or two thousand dollars in gas money?

In the 70s, the "manly" cars started disappearing, (due to CAFE, safety rules, emissions rules, etc) to be replaced with a new crop of particularly "girly" cars. That huge middle market said, "Ewwww!" and fled to trucks, which were still considered manly. And with the coming "refinements" to THEM, they became less crude (but still manly).

We are now in the midst of the return of the "manly" car! (You can figure out which ones they are on your own) That huge middle market can now safely return to car buying without risking their manliness membership card.



Oh hush up! You're just jealous that you didn't think of it first!

[tgagneguam]

Originally Posted by PhishPhood

Obviously it doesn't make sense from a purely financial comparo aspect but there is also the very basic concept that people are free to spend their money as they wish whether it's on trips to Vegas, investments in penny stocks, a massive CD collection, etc etc.

Yes to minimize total transportation costs it makes sense to trade in the pickup and buy a used compact. But that may have repercussions on other aspects of family life and personal enjoyment. Keeping the pickup or SUV when it comes time to replace it and getting a more efficient daily driver seems like a smart move to me. Then one has a lot of options available.

The point of doing so was to save money, so I am rightfully questioning the wisdom of the move on that point alone. As you pointed out, people are clearly free to spend their money the way they choose. I'm definitely in support of that, so we agree!

I know I don't have to connect the dots for you, PhishPhood; you're much too smart to need to have someone do that for you.

[mbukukanyau]

Jeeeeez...Then why is Ford F150 still the best selling vehicle ever? Closely followed by the Silvarado? Am I missing something? Why are these trucks still outselling the Aveo and Yaris?

[GMC-70]

There goes the media spinning things again! Americans still love trucks. The problem is many can no longer afford them and are seeking cheaper alternitives---I know I did.

This has nothing to do with big SUVS as being a fad---it has everything to do with the current state of the economy and thats all there is to it.

[Suzuki Phil]

I bought a 07 Chevy 2500 Classic Duramax last year. Yes the price of diesel concerned me somewhat but I'm not going to let a few extra dollars destroy my way of life. My family and I camp and ride dirt bikes. Even with diesel at $4.20 here in California we still go out camping, not as much as before but we go. I'm planning a trip to Utah this summer and I'm estimating my expenses using $5.00 a gal for diesel, don't like it but I'll make up for it in different places. There are more important things in life then a few more dollars spent for hours of time with my kids. Go ahead sit at home and watch Oprah, I'm living life even if it cost me more.

I drive an economy car (Suzuki) to work and in the summer plan to ride my gas sipping motorcyle (Suzuki) to work.

SP

[Saturn69]

....and we don't love them any less, either.

They aren't going anywhere, they'll still sell trucks to those that need them and/or want them. However, buying one as your daily driver might not be as prevalent as it used to be. Air haulers will decline in numbers, surely, but they won't become extinct, and I think compact SUV's (Vue, X3, RAV4, etc.) will grow in sales while full-size ones decline, at least as, again, daily drivers. They'll still sell full-size ones to those that can justify - to themselves - the need and added expense that comes with the increased size. Bimmers had their day in the late 80's/early 90's; SUVs/Full-size trucks had their day in the late 90's/early 00's.

[Whitesky]

With the overall economy struggling, it's hard to tell what is having the greatest impact on truck sales. It could be gas prices, less money to buy new vehicles, more difficulty in securing loans, taste...etc..

Trucks will always be bought whether it's for need or want. Some of us will never buy a little econobox or gas saver podcar regardless of gas prices. Just as long as GM makes some of EVERY vehicle type, they should be ok.

[Cortazzo]

Do we really need full size trucks to be as large and heavy as they are now? It seems to me that people that use their trucks for work (farm duties, construction, etc) were able to get by with much smaller trucks in the 80s and early 90s. It seems that today's midsize trucks would be considered full size not too long ago, today's half tons would be considered 1 tons etc. I'm sure we'll see a gradual downsizing as fullsize trucks adopt turbo v6s to help save on mileage and lots more diesels. There is no such thing as a fullsize truck in europe or asia, and they still farm and do large construction projects just fine it seems.

But I have absolutely no problem with the folks that are willing to spend the extra to fuel a large truck, that is their absolute right to spend how they like, i just think they will be less folks over time who will make that choice.

[EldoFan]

Originally Posted by Cortazzo

I have absolutely no problem with the folks that are willing to spend the extra to fuel a large truck, that is their absolute right to spend how they like, i just think they will be less folks over time who will make that choice.

Agreed.....

I tell ya, if I was earning a little more (and could afford it)......I'd take a nice long look at the used truck segment.....it is an absolute buyers market. Kinda odd though how the S10's (around here at least) are demanding a premium over some MY F150's & Silverado 1500's